Malacachtli/malacachoa

[IDIEZ]

Quena Vic,
	Huan Delfina quicuamachilia quence macehualli tlen quipiya iixxayac chipactic. 
	Vic, ¿queniuhqui ticcaqui nopa "a" tlen achtohui? ¿Huehueyac zo cuecuetztzin? ¿i:xma:lacachtic zo i:xmalacachtic?
John

On Mar 26, 2012, at 4:01 PM, De la Cruz wrote:

> 
> 
>  Ce tlamanextilli.
> 
> Ixmalacachtic. Macehualli, tlapiyalli zo tecuani tlen quipiya iixayac yahualtic...
> 
> 
>  
> Ma cueponi totlahtol. 'que nuestra lengua florezca'
> 
> Victoriano de la Cruz Cruz
> New-Phone:  5548657687
> 
> 
> 
> > From: idiez at me.com
> > Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2012 14:50:41 -0600
> > To: magnuspharao at gmail.com
> > CC: nahuatl at lists.famsi.org
> > Subject: Re: [Nahuat-l] Malacachtli/malacachoa
> > 
> > Piyali Magnus,
> > But malacatl has no long vowels, and malacachtli has a long initial a (ma:lacachtli).
> > John
> > 
> > On Mar 26, 2012, at 12:11 PM, Magnus Pharao Hansen wrote:
> > 
> > > Listeros,
> > > 
> > > I was too quick to dismiss the possibility of the *malacachoa *being
> > > derived from *malacachtli*. I had forgotten that -*oa *was used to derive
> > > denominal verbs in classical Nahuatl (Launey 1986 pp. 958-959*). It does
> > > seem to be the simplest explanation. However, that does not explain the
> > > relation between *malacachtli *and *malacatl,* which is another interesting
> > > question.
> > > 
> > > It seems to me that here the most logical solution is to look for a way
> > > that *malacachtli *and *malacatl *derives historically from a single root -
> > > probably /**malaka*/.The question then becomes what is the root of the -*ch*-
> > > between the root and the absolutive suffix in the form *malaca-ch-tli*.
> > > 
> > > We know that Proto-Nahuan only had CV syllables, so the -ch- must be the
> > > remnant of a CV syllable that was reduced by the general accent shift rule
> > > that reduced the penultimate syllable of words with more than two syllables
> > > (described in Canger 1980).
> > > 
> > > Dakin (1982:96) derives a number of verbs in -*choa *from forms with a
> > > previous suffix -*čo/ča*- which she reconstructs as meaning
> > > "frecuentative". An example /kwekwečoa/ "to make tremble" and *chachacuachoa
> > > *"to make rough (splattered?). Interestingly both of these have an
> > > intransitive counterpart with -tz- /kwekwetzoa/ "to tremble" and *
> > > chachacuatza *"to splatter mud", and so does *ma:pi:choa */ *ma:pi:tza *"to
> > > whistle with ones hand". There are other examples of pairs with tz/ch for
> > > example *cinhuechtli *"volunteer maize" from *cin *"maize" and *huetzi *"to
> > > fall", and *cacalachtli *"rattle" that seems related to *cacalatza "*to
> > > rattle". There are also odd pairs like *patla:wa/patlachtik* that are not
> > > readily analyzable as derivations of each other - they must also share
> > > derivational histories from a single root somehow (do we have any
> > > attestations of a verb *patlatza*?).
> > > 
> > > We also know that frequently Nahuatl / č / comes from
> > > proto-Uto-Aztecan *¢ before the high central vowel *ʉ. This makes it
> > > probable that the syllable from which the -ch- is derived was /*¢ʉ/. This
> > > could explain the Intransitive -*tza/tzoa* - transitive -*choa *pairs, if
> > > the intransitive form was /*¢i/ (which would lead to -tziwa and eventually
> > > -tzoa (following the path laid out by Canger 1980)) and the
> > > transitive /*¢ʉ/ which would lead to -*choa *through **čiwa*.
> > > 
> > > If, following this reasoning, we were to posit that *malachoa *was derived
> > > from a previous /*malaka-¢ʉ-wa/ then *malakachtli *would come from the
> > > nominal form /*malaka-¢ʉ-ta/ and *malacachihui *from /*malaka-¢ʉ-wi/. This
> > > suggests that while it is possible to derive *malacachtli *directly
> > > from *malacachoa
> > > *- it is equally possible that both historically derived from the same
> > > etymon and not directly synchronically from each other. By positing a
> > > historical derivation we solve the issue of the *malacachtli/malacatl*pair.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > *http://celia.cnrs.fr/FichExt/Etudes/Launey/tm.htm
> > > 
> > > -- 
> > > Magnus Pharao Hansen
> > > PhD. student
> > > Department of Anthropology
> > > 
> > > Brown University
> > > 128 Hope St.
> > > Providence, RI 02906
> > > 
> > > *magnus_pharao_hansen at brown.edu*
> > > US: 001 401 651 8413
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Nahuatl mailing list
> > > Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org
> > > http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl
> > 
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