> [SEELANGS] sub-titles

Tue Apr 8 17:08:23 UTC 2008

Menippean satire is therapeutic. A shared sense of outrage may break 
down barriers and reveal essentials perhaps?

Will Ryan

Sarah Hurst wrote:
> I think the film attempted to offend as many different racial and minority
> groups as it could - and succeeded!
>
> Sarah Hurst
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list
> [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Vardanyan, Ashot
> Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 8:47 AM
> To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] > [SEELANGS] sub-titles
>
> Anyway, if it comes to my personal opinion, I was not very happy to hear my
> mother tongue in such a mean film. I had a feeling my language was
> associated with the humiliating plot of the content. Now, I think some Jews
> could have the same view.
>  
> Ashot
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list on
> behalf of Evgeny Steiner
> Sent: Tue 08-Apr-08 10:02
> To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] > [SEELANGS] sub-titles
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sarah Hurst <sarahhurst at ALASKA.NET>
> To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU
> Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2008 13:24:36 -0800
> Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] > [SEELANGS] sub-titles
>
> It's nonsense if one is talking Hebrew, the other is replying in Armenian,
> and they are both pretending to be speaking Kazakh.
>
> Oh, I thought it was a rather cunning joke to make that Anti-Semitic
> simpleton to speak Hebrew. But possibly the authors of Borat had to be more
> considerate to those film critics to whom either Armenian or Hebrew sound
> like nonsense.
>
> ES
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list
> [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Evgeny Steiner
> Sent: Monday, April 07, 2008 11:45 AM
> To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] > [SEELANGS] sub-titles
>
> "Really a nonsense language"???
> Sasha Baron-Cohen was talking good Hebrew.
>
> Evgeny Steiner
> Sainsbury Inst. for the Japanese Art
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sarah Hurst <sarahhurst at ALASKA.NET>
> To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU
> Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2008 10:52:48 -0800
> Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] > [SEELANGS] sub-titles
>
> In Borat the two main characters are supposed to be speaking the same
> language to each other (ostensibly Kazakh). As it's really a nonsense
> language each actor just speaks in whatever foreign language he knows, with
> Sasha Baron-Cohen throwing in quite a few Polish words, I think. So it
> wouldn't really make sense to differentiate the subtitles and indicate that
> one actor is speaking Armenian.
>
> Sarah Hurst
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list
> [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Ashot Vardanyan
> Sent: Monday, April 07, 2008 10:31 AM
> To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: [SEELANGS] > [SEELANGS] sub-titles
>
> Dear Michele,
>
> My notes are somewhat different from what you want but might be of interest
> as well.
>
> I want to share my observation and impression on the language(s) and
> subtitles of two films âEUR" Russian âEURoePrisoner of MountainâEUR
> (âEURoeKavkazskii plennikâEUR) and American / British âEURoeBorat: cultural
> learnings of America for make benefit glorious nation of KazakhstanâEUR. In
> both films the non-Armenian viewer naively reckons s/he hears the same
> language from the characters as s/he reads the English subtitles.
>
> The scene of the former is set in the Russian North Caucasus, supposedly in
> Chechnya, the country that definitely has its own language. The filmmakers,
> however, run a unique trick: the local men and women speak in the main three
> languages of the entire Caucasus: Georgian, Azerbaijani, which is very
> similar to Turkish, and Armenian. There might be other Caucasian languages
> that I donâEUR(tm)t know; however, from the outset, it was unusual to hear
> Georgian between Abdul-Murat and his daughter, but later the idea of the
> producers became clear: they probably aimed at demonstrating the commonality
> of all Caucasians which is, in turn, very dissonant to truth. The entire
> Caucasus is a bundle of problems.
>
> Armenian, my language, is represented by its âEURoehamshenaâEUR dialect
> that is used by Armenians populating the Black Sea region. It appears only
> in the episode of the childrenâEUR(tm)s talk, when a boy asks Dina if it is
> already time for her to marry. It seems to me, this is also political. The
> filmmakers couldnâEUR(tm)t help knowing that Armenia and Russia are allies
> in all domains, whereas Georgia and Azerbaijan informally supported
> ChechnyaâEUR(tm)s insurgency and had other conflicts in their relations with
> Russia.
>
> In âEURoeBoratâEUR¦âEUR, Azamat Bagatov, the partner of the main character,
> speaks Armenian during all the span of the film. As a matter of fact, the
> person who stars for him is an American Armenian actor Ken Davitian. He uses
> the mixture of the Eastern and Western Armenian dialects. I donâEUR(tm)t
> remember what language Borat speaks, to the best of my memory, itâEUR(tm)s
> either / both Russian or / and Kazakh but itâEUR(tm)s definitely not
> Armenian. However, viewers donâEUR(tm)t know this and follow the subtitles
> being under the impression the characters sound the same language.
>
> âEUR¦The quality of this film is a different topic.
>
> Best,
> Ashot Vardanyan,
> University of Iowa.
>
>
> 04/06 17:25 "Michele A. Berdy" <maberdy at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
>   
>> Seelangers, o ye who know and see all...
>>
>> Have any of you seen a multi-language film with sub-titles that
>> distinguish between the languages spoken? If so, how did the
>> sub-titles make the language distinction clear? Font? Italics?
>> Other?
>>
>> Feel free to send comments off list (this is fairly obscure...)
>> Thanks
>>
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