Same word, different meanings

[Carolyn Quintero]

In Osage, 'to stand' has a long nasal a:N.  'To rain', on the other hand, is either ni'z^u or nu'z^u, where the first syllable vowel is not long, or at least is not so long as the a:N in 'to stand'. I don't write 'rain' with a long vowel.
Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: "R. Rankin" <rankin at ku.edu>
Sent: Oct 28, 2004 11:38 PM
To: siouan at lists.colorado.edu
Subject: Re: Same word, different meanings

'To stand' has a long nasal a:N.  Dunno about 'rain'            Bob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Koontz John E" <John.Koontz at colorado.edu>
To: "Siouan List" <siouan at lists.colorado.edu>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 7:07 PM
Subject: Re: Same word, different meanings


> On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Rory M Larson wrote:
> > Just did that, and got shot down.  This time our speaker
> > held that noNz^iN 'stand' and noNz^iN 'rain' are in fact
> > homonyms, as Kathy originally stated. ...
>
> >   S^ettaN'na naNz^iN' naNz^iN'.
> >   Still      rain     stands
> >   It's still raining.
>
> This is just the reaction I got in 1985, with the same example, almost.  I
> got just:
>
> NaNz^iN naNz^iN.  'It keeps on raining.'
>
> This was considered a bit along the lines of word play, I think, though
> not characterized as humorous.  It was just considered interesting that
> you could say this.
>
> Mind you, this kind of assurance from a native speaker doesn't apply if
> you can actually hear a difference or find a test that demonstrates that
> the speakers themselves hear one they aren't aware of.  For example,
> record several tokens of each, shuffle them into a known order, and see if
> people can usually distinguish 'He's standing' from 'It's raining'.  Even
> if it's proverbial that it's hard to tell, and a source of humor, etc.,
> there might be a difference.
>
> For example, my understanding is that American English speakers have
> trouble hearing some vowel contrasts.  I think cot : caught is notorious
> in this regard.  Some folks contrast the pair, some don't and some do, but
> think they don't.  Some don't but think they do.  I think there is
> instrumental evidence that some people who think there is no contrast make
> one.
>
> Apart from this, two similar forms might differ in some intonational
> contexts, but not in others.  For example, they might sound the same in
> isolation, but behave differently following a particular preceding forms,
> etc.
>
> Anyway, I couldn't hear one myself in this case, apart from the first
> being overall higher than the second in the example - presumably due to
> downstepping in a phrase - but I don't entirely trust my ear with it, so
> that Rory's report of a subtle difference didn't strike me as at all
> implausible.  In isolation the two forms certainly sounded the same to me.
>
> Isn't there a 'hair' form that falls into this homophonous set, too, in
> OP but not in the rest of Dhegiha?
>
>