Padouca

[Koontz John E]

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005, David Costa wrote:
> In various forms, it's attested in Miami, Shawnee, Sauk, and Meskwaki.
>
> >> In Algonquian languages, the 'Padouca' name always indicates the Comanches.

In modern Siouan languages it refers to the Comanche, too, or to an
unknown group.  I think it's probably safer to say that ethnohistorians
are reasonably sure that before it referred to the Comanche it refered to
their antecedants, apparently Plains Apache gorups, perhaps with the Kiowa
included.  The more or less seemless shift from Apache to Comanche
suggests it applies to people forma given area, or with a particular
cultural or subsistance pattern, rather than to specific linguistic
groups.

>>From the pre-Comanche through the early Comanche periods we are in the
period before vocabulary lists for Siouan languages, and very nearly so
for Miami-Illinois.  The sources for the term(s) in this period are French
texts.  The source of the form seems to be Dhegiha, Ioway-Otoe and
possibly Miami-Illinois sources, presumably with a tendency toward
Miami-Illinois intermediaries.  I'm not really able to site chapter and
verse on the arguments these days.

A somewhat similar pattern exists for the various terms for Northern
Caddoan groups which lead to modern English Pawnee, except that the
reference remains "Northern Caddoan."

The etymologies for both terms are obscure, though Padouca might be 'round
head', assuming that some u and n confusion was involved early on, and
assuming that the term as it occurs in some modern languages has been
borrowed from French.