3-D Symbols

Fri May 14 17:10:51 UTC 2004

SignWriting List
May 14, 2004

Dear SW List:
The SignWriting List listserve software seems to be having problems 
lately...Not all messages that people post make it to the List...Some 
of mine never post too...I have no clue what to do, so I have an 
understanding with Adam Frost that he will send me a copy of each 
message he posts privately to me too, so just in case it does not post, 
I can then post it for him...so here is one message from Adam that 
never made it to the List:

---------------------------

        From:     seniorafrost at hotmail.com
        Subject:        Re: 3-D Symbols
        Date:   May 14, 2004 3:36:42 AM PDT
        To:       SW-L at ADMIN.HUMBERC.ON.CA, sutton at signwriting.org

> "Is the "W" hand different from the "6" hand all the
> time or is it a "variant" without a real difference?"

This is a question that I have been asked a lot. It is similar to the 
"F" and "9" question. I happen to have the answer because I have 
searched it out. :-) (Just a fun little fact that most don't really 
know.)

The fingers for the numbers touch on the "tips" or the pads, while the 
fingers for the letters touch one in front of the other. (ie one finger 
is on the other's fingernail.) I know that this can be a little hard to 
understand. I you really want me to, I can explain it more.

Adam

-----------------------------

On May 13, 2004, at 8:04 PM, Charles Butler wrote:

> Hi Valerie and all,
>
> We will definitely need to see, particularly with the
> IMWA, what languages use which symbols as
> "minimal pairs".  For English, for example, we really
> don't distinguish between k and q and could easily
> write "kwik" rather than "quick" and be understood.
> Linguistic questions for ASL users might include:
>
> "Is the "W" hand different from the "6" hand all the
> time or is it a "variant" without a real difference?"
>
> And mechanically, for you, dear Valerie, who have
> indefatigably created all 96 variations of everything,
> we should work on a graphics program that will
> automatically generate all 96 flips of a given "newly
> generated" figure if it's needed, rather than you
> having to do it manually.  That's what computers are
> for, to take the tedium out of generating new
> graphics.
>
> Blessings,
>
> Charles Butler
>
> --- Valerie Sutton <sutton at SIGNWRITING.ORG> wrote:
>> SignWriting List
>> May 13, 2004
>>
>> Hello Everyone, and Charles!
>> Thanks for this question. I will be happy to mark a
>> place for them in
>> the numbering system. Yes, they belong under 3-D
>> Symbols and it is easy
>> to give them a spot. But I have around 5000 symbols
>> to add still, just
>> for the basic handshapes and movement symbols and
>> not even talking
>> about the 3-D symbols - they haven't been entered
>> yet at all...I have
>> simply marked a spot for them...At this point I am
>> pretty tired, and I
>> don't know what to do...There are so many symbols to
>> enter that we are
>> going to have to be realistic about it...the 3-D
>> symbols will have to
>> come after all the needed handshapes...I believe I
>> am going to have to
>> release an IMWA version 1.0, and then later, create
>> a 2.0 with more
>> symbols. So the 3-D symbols, whether they be the
>> ones used in
>> DanceWriting, or yours, used in SignWriting, will
>> have to wait for
>> version 2.0....
>>
>> If you think about it, just the straight index
>> finger alone, could have
>> around 20 possible base rootshapes...the index on an
>> E hand, the index
>> on an E hand that only touches the thumb with the
>> middle finger, and so
>> forth...and each one of those has 96 rotations and
>> flops...so it is
>> rediculous, actually! ;-)
>>
>> Val ;-)
>>
>> -------------------------
>>
>> On May 13, 2004, at 1:46 PM, Charles Butler wrote:
>>
>>> RE: 3-D Symbols
>>>
> È   > Curious, is my suggestion of a slanted circle (45
>> degrees as opposed
>>> to the 90 degree circle) available in this version
>> for a quick writing
>>> of boat, house, and all the others that require 45
>> degrees without
>>> having to create 96 3/4-hand shapes? È  It would fit
>> here under 3-D
>>> symbols like the "underneath" half circle as a
>> category by itself.
>>>
> È   > Charles
>>>
>>> Valerie Sutton <sutton at SIGNWRITING.ORG> wrote:
>>> SignWriting List
>>> May 13, 2004
>>>
>>> The 3-D Symbols today are even more sophisticated.
>> They will be
>>> available in the International Movement Writing
>> Alphabet (the IMWA).
>>> The IMWA has eight symbol categories:
>>>
>>> Category 01 - Hand
>>> Category 02 - Movement
>>> Category 03 - Face
>>> Category 04 - Head
>>> Category 05 - UpperBody
>>> Category 06 - FullBody
>>> Category 07 - Space
>>> Category 08 - Punctuation
>>>
>>> Category 07, Space, includes symbols that show
>> spatial
>>> relationships...such as Height, Width, Depth...and
>> also 3D Symbols. In
>>> the early history of SignWriting, we used the 3D
>> symbols for the upper
>>> body only, but then, over time, they were dropped
>> because that kind of
>>> detail is really for research use...for daily use,
>> we write the third
>>> dimension in other ways...
>>>
>>> Here is an explanation of the 3D Symbols from our
>> DanceWriting web
>>> site:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> ATTACHMENT part 2 image/gif x-mac-type=47494666;
>> x-unix-mode=0644;
>>> x-mac-creator=3842494D; name=3DSymbols.gif
>