AW: AW: [sw-l] CZJ - Czech sign language: SKOLA (school) - video

[Honza]

Hi Stefan,

yes I know on video you cannot see much, so that is why I told you about 
handshape :)
But that is not question.

About movement: at first I also just used arrows like you (two times 
up), but than I recognized the movement is not only up but curved (as 
Tomas or somebody else wrote in SignWriting).... so I think that just 
two-times-up-arrows are not enought..

Webcam shoud be often very helpful to have comeback of our writings. One 
person writes, second read and signs.
Stefan and everybody, have a nice week ;)

Honza


Stefan Wöhrmann wrote:

>Hi Honza, 
>
>- smile - 
>hand-shape  is not correct? 
>
>Why should I vote for a wrong hand shape symbol? Any idea?  - smile!!
>L.I.F.E: 
>
>Well - I write what I see - 
>
>We are not mathematics to measure the exact degree of the angle ;-)) 
>
>I saw several spellings with the fingers bent - so you get this 90 degree
>hand shape. 
>
>What I perceive is something different. It should be possible to make a
>screenshot. This still would show a flat hand!? - 
>
>I see somebody putting his right hand ( flat hand thumb up) between his left
>upper arm and body. 
>
>It would be possible to execute a performance with kind of rotation movement
>- and if you want to see that - it should be possible - 
>
>I  myself understand this performance as more a multiple pretty short upward
>movement. 
>
>So in order to get to this end positon  you have to move your right hand
>around until the back of your right hands shows to the left! This often
>causes some kind of hinge-movement at the knuckle-joints - 
>
>In the video I cannot see this that much.
>
>So we have to find a way to write what we see. smile 
>
>Within several performances of different signers or even the same signer you
>may find some kind of variation and in SW you will find you in the place to
>vote for this or that or an additional extra hand shape. 
>
>Whether a spelling is correct or not is sometimes difficult to decide. Smile
>- some spellings are definitely violating rules or are totally different
>from what the performance shows. 
>
>In this case - well the uninformed competent reader would show us! - smile 
>
>Stefan;-)) 
>
>
> 
>-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>Von: owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>[mailto:owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag von Honza
>Gesendet: Sonntag, 21. August 2005 15:13
>An: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>Betreff: Re: AW: [sw-l] CZJ - Czech sign language: SKOLA (school) - video
>
>sorry, I always forgot something.
>I meant just head and mouthing is signed as on your picture.
>The handshape in your writing of SKOLA is not correct.
>H.
>
>
>Hi Stefan and everybody.
>
>it is funny to see SKOLA written with mouthbuilder :)
>Yes, sure, it depends on situation when is the signlanguage used.
>Signs like on video are signned in this way often in schools or on TV
>(because as they say "not only Deafs are watching broadcasting for the
>deafs, but also hard of hearings, loss of hearings, so we use the way of
>language the most people can understand").
>
>In general mouthing (as articulating words) is not fixed part of czech
>signs (even if some people use it)
>Anyway, SKOLA is mostly signed like your second picture  ;-)
>
>Honza
>
>Stefan Wöhrmann wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Hi Honza, Tomas, Shane, Valerie, Charles ... sw -list
>>
>>
>>today I looked for the fist time at this "skola -video" - 
>>
>>There are - as always many more variations how to write the sign in SW. 
>>
>>Looking at Shane's comment ("crap and shit" )- I had to smile. 
>>
>>Well if you would accept that the signer is actually doing a lot with his
>>mouth - (smile) you would not identify this sign as " a total crap" -- or
>>"total shit" - 
>>
>>Dr Penny Boyes Braem  from Switzerland made me very attentive to these
>>"Mundbilder" 
>>
>>So obviously the sign that is shown in this video is a combination of kind
>>of "voiceless articulation movements" which can be written with my
>>Mundbildschrift - 
>>
>>
>>looking at the hand and at the moovement I can imagine a different spelling
>>... 
>>
>>So it depends who should get the information. Students who  are on their
>>    
>>
>way
>  
>
>>to use bilingual materials in order to develop Spoken Language skills will
>>definitely take advantage out of a very detailed spelling - .
>>
>>Once they know the terms in SL and Spoken Languages a less detailed
>>Mundbildschrift would do it - if there are no similar signs - which can
>>    
>>
>lead
>  
>
>>to confusion. But that depends on the scribes knowledge of the given SL
>>    
>>
>and
>  
>
>>his intentions. 
>>
>>
>>Stefan ;-)) 
>>
>>-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>Von: owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>>[mailto:owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag von Valerie Sutton
>>Gesendet: Donnerstag, 18. August 2005 23:26
>>An: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>>Betreff: Re: [sw-l] CZJ - Czech sign language: SKOLA (school) - video
>>
>>SignWriting List
>>August 18, 2005
>>
>>Shane Ó hEorpa wrote:
>> 
>>
>>    
>>
>>>In British Sign Language, that sign mean "a total crap" or "a total  
>>>shit" if
>>>done once - if twice, it mean "it is rubbish" or "it is crap"
>>>   
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>Great. This means that you can copy the sign for Skola in the Czech  
>>SignPuddle and paste it into the BSL SignPuddle, and change the name  
>>of the sign, and you don't have to re-write it! That will add one  
>>more sign to the BSL SignPuddle!  Val ;-)
>>
>>PS. List members...If you need instructions on how to paste signs  
>>    
>>
>>from one SignPuddle to another, just ask me!
>  
>
>> 
>>
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