# left, right and both arrows

Charles Butler chazzer3332000 at YAHOO.COM
Thu Mar 9 15:36:26 UTC 2006

```Just for my feedback on this issue, I've been using the "joint arrow" for parallel paths moving in the same direction for years.  It makes a much faster way to write "long and winding path" and I think, for me, it goes with the "feel" of the sign.  If it feels like two hands moving separately, like "two people walking side by side" then it gets two arrows.  Mostly, I'd write it for straight out, or any forward/back arrows, but not for up and down.  It's parallel and simultaneous motion with the same handshapes on both hands, or different if the two handshapes are holding on to each other, for me.

That's my personal style.

Charles Butler

Valerie Sutton <sutton at signwriting.org> wrote:
SignWriting List
March 9, 2006

On Mar 9, 2006, at 5:54 AM, Gallant, Philippe wrote:
> I did use attachment to add two diagrams and apparently it is not
> working. Here I am again... If not working, you can look it up at
> depression and depression_2.
>
>> From your previous instructions I understand but for this, can we do
> like depression_2? Since we can use two hands move together but
> use one
> 'both' arrow with out touch two hands together. I noticed many signs
> that has two hands moving together at the same time without touch each
> other can use one 'both' arrow instead two arrows for left and right
> hands.

Hello Philippe and everyone!
Your attachments worked this time...many thanks! And now I have
attached those two signs plus a third that I just entered too...

I understand your question, Philippe, because this question has come
up before...here is the summary...

1. SAME MOVEMENT PATH (one path is on top of the other path)
The General Arrowhead was developed when we tried to write a white
and dark arrow on top of each other...because the two movement paths
happened in the SAME path...so the General arrow was designed to mean
the SAME movement path...and as you know, the sign for DEPRESSION in
ASL does not have movement on the SAME path...they are painting two
paths, right and left, far apart from each other...so following the
rule at the moment, the sign for DEPRESSION would have to have two
arrows...one for right path and one for left path...

2. PARALLEL MOVEMENT PATHS (going in same direction, but the two
paths are not on top of each other)
You, and others before you, have suggested that instead of meaning
the SAME path, the general arrow could mean BOTH hands moving in
PARALLEL paths...and there are other groups, such as the Danish
researchers using SignWriting, who have done that officially for
writing Danish Sign Language in SignWriting...other countries have
not chosen to do this...so this is one area where I need to get some
new rules specific to this issue...

So now...what to do? I have to ask others about a new rule stating
that the General Arrow could mean PARALLEL PATHS...it is not simple
because thousands of people use SignWriting now and I am trying to
keep the system used the same all over the world as best as is
possible...smile...

Keep writing and whichever you choose, just be aware that at the
moment number 2 above is not considered correct within the current
rules...smile...I don't know what else to say! I will inform you
when I get some feedback from others...it would change a lot of books
on SignWriting! smile...

Thanks very much, Philippe, for your suggestion...I appreciate it
that you asked and that we can discuss this in the future too...
Val ;-)

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