SVG version of our IMWA symbols

Thu Apr 26 03:07:33 UTC 2007

What does AFAIK mean? 

Adam

-----Original Message-----
From: "Stuart Thiessen" <sw at passitonservices.org>
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 21:57:51 
To:sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
Subject: Re: [sw-l] SVG version of our IMWA symbols

AFAIK, on a browser, everything is cached unless the server indicates it should not be. So I wouldn't be too worried about that.

Thanks,

Stuart

On Apr 25, 2007, at 18:19, Jonathan wrote:

 Valerie Sutton wrote: SignWriting List 
 April 25, 2007 

 Yes, that is correct. Steve Slevinski asked for the SVG version of our symbols for programming...so I will put that as a priority...it is my responsibility to finish the IMWA so we can move forward with SVG... 

 It will take some time for me to complete the IMWA 1.4 in bitmaps, but I hope to do that this year, the sooner the better, and then the entire IMWA 1.4 will need to be placed into SVG...Machado has already done a lot of the symbols in SVG...so it is a matter of making sure that every new symbol is added to the current set of SVG... 

 And I know there are different typeface designs that can be done in SVG, so there can be different writing styles of the same symbols and it may be that someday there will be different sets of SVG so we can choose typefaces... 

 I read your message below, Jonathan, and the problem is, I am not a programmer. I just want to provide every programmer with what they need, to program using SignWriting. 
      Val, 
        I am glad you are working on getting the symbols to SVG as well.  I guess it really is the best option for the online community.  The project that I am working in my spare time is using the PNG format which are working very well for my needs.  I'm sure that Steve and Sandy will be for of the first to use the SVG symbols and I probably will follow not long after.

 I understand your concerns about SVG taking bandwidth, if you do not have a stable internet connection, and it may be that in countries where that is the norm, another version of the symbols in bitmap form will be necessary...I have to leave that to the programming experts... 
  After all, the SVG will probably the better way even if it couldn't be cached because only a few or even one symbols needs to be downloaded to do all 96 fills and rotations.

 SVG is easier than creating True Type fonts the old way...so I can see it has value, because the symbols look better on the screen and they reduce with better quality I believe... 
  BTW do you know if Stephan ever finished our sign names as fonts?

 Thanks for all your messages, Jonathan! 

 it is hard to keep up with so many messages these days! 
  So many great lists to be eh?  :-) 

 Val ;-) 

 ---------- 

 On Apr 25, 2007, at 10:07 AM, Steve Slevinski wrote: 

 Jonathan, 

 I am the one requesting an SVG 

 Jonathan wrote: 
 An SVG version of the IMWA symbols seems exciting.  I was wondering we advantages this might have.  I know that currently the PNG symbols are cacheable so this is better for us that have lower bandwidth as we only have to get each symbol once. I briefly looked into the SVG and it seems to be inline so it comes as part of the web page.  I don't think that it would be cacheable but I could be wrong. If the SVG is part of the page, then the browser wouldn't have to get each symbol one by one, it would load faster on the browser but the server would have to resend the symbol on each web page refresh so it might be a bit longer to load each page for those of us with lower bandwith.  Though on second thought, if we don't have to get each rotation it might even be faster. 
     I was thinking on the savings are far as rotations  for only the handshapes using the SVG.  Presently there are about 207 hand shapes with 6 distinct fills rotated 8 different positions then mirrored and rotated another 8 positions.  So for each of the 207 there are 6 fills X 16 rotations = 96 symbols per hand shape.  207 handshapes X 96 symbols each =  19872 handshape symbols.  Now if we only had to draw the 6 fills for the 207 handshapes, we would only have to define 207 X 6 =  1242 symbols which SVG could easily mirror and rotate all the ways we wanted to.  So with SVG we would only need to define 6% of the current handshape symbols.  That's like 94% improvement. Not bad!!! Some of the other arrows etc can also be rotated and flipped to make up the full set. However there wouldn't be any savings as far as the face symbols or some of the punctuation is concerned. 
     I guess when we have made a few, we will have a better idea how they compare in size to the PNG symbols.  I wonder if they would be any smaller as many symbols have a lot of parts that have to be described.  The median PNG symbol file size is only 232 bytes.  It going to be hard to beat that but with a 90-94% savings from rotating them on the SVG I guess it would really be worth it. 
     I the other more immediate benefit would be that they are easily scalable.  This would be better for captioning or people who have bad eyesight. 
 What else have your learned about doing the IMWA in SVG? 
 Jonathan 

 I am going to step out in the beautiful Springtime air and be back shortly - 

 Val ;-) 

 ----------- 

 On Apr 21, 2007, at 11:29 AM, Cherie Wren wrote: 

 I volunteer to help... 

 cherie 

 ----- Original Message ---- 
 From: Valerie Sutton <sutton at signwriting.org>: <mailto:sutton at signwriting.org>  
 To: List SignWriting <sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu>: <mailto:sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu>  
 Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 8:41:27 PM 
 Subject: [sw-l] Wikipedia American Sign Language 

 SignWriting List 
 April 20, 2007 

 Hello SW List Members! 

 As you all know, recently there has been interest in creating a 
 possible ASL Wikipedia, or at least, the beginning of writing an 
 Encyclopedia in ASL... 

 Since we are new to writing and posting documents on the web, in our 
 SignPuddle 1.5 Literature Puddle online, I realize that this is a 
 very big leap forward, to start writing encyclopedia articles in ASL! 

 To write such an article, we would need to either choose an article 
 already written in another encyclopedia, and then translate it from 
 English to ASL and then write it in SignWriting in SignText... 

 or... 

 write it directly from our own knowledge of physics, or geography or 
 whatever the article is about! 

 This seems like a big new project, doesn't it? 

 Sooo...here is my thought... 

 Do we have volunteers to help us write one test-article for a new 
 encyclopedia written in ASL? 

 It will be our FIRST article for an encyclopedia in ASL...like a test 
 drive. Then we can show the document to those at Wikimedia and to 
 others too...It will be an historic and interesting adventure... 

 I know many of you are already overloaded with projects, so only 
 volunteer if you feel you have the time. We could create an 
 Encylopedia team of writers, and each person could take a small 
 section of the translation and writing... 

 And there is no rush and no deadline. 

 Plus we need to choose the one article we want to write... 

 But before we choose the article, is there anyone interested in 
 volunteering to write an article for an Encyclopedia? 

 Once we have a few volunteers, I will write to the Wikimedia language 
 committee to suggest that maybe they can choose one article for us to 
 translate from the Wikipedia in English online... 

 Those are my thoughts... 

 What are yours? 

 Val ;-) 

 Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? 
 Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. 

 -- 
 Jonathan & Yolaine Duncan 
 8-)  & ;-) 

-- 

 Jonathan & Yolaine Duncan
  8-)  & ;-)  