Sign Names in SignWriting ;-)

K.J. Boal kjoanne403 at HOTMAIL.COM
Wed May 2 01:30:54 UTC 2007 

>From: "Valerie Sutton" <signwriting at MAC.COM>
>Reply-To: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>To: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>Subject: [sw-l] Sign Names in SignWriting ;-)
>Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 08:05:05 -0700
>
>Stefan is correct, Charles...This sign name for Kelly Jo needs to be  
>discussed a little...
>
>I would probably write it this way:
>


><< image.php.png >>


>
I appreciate the comment... but I'm not sure I like how it looks.  Both the 
"K" and the "J" actually touch the same place on the arm, right in the crook 
of the elbow, which is REALLY hard to write!

>
>
>Let's discuss this original writing:
>


><< unknown.jpg >>


>
>I certainly can see why this was hard to write! and I also understand  that 
>we need to review the Rotation symbols for everyone's sake...
>
>
>First look at the I hand...it is in this position...
>
>


><< I-Hand.png >>


>
>
>That is just physically very hard to do!
>
True... especially since the drawing is of the left hand and the letter is 
signed with the right hand!

>
>And the Rotation Symbol ....
>
>This symbols means the forearm is parallel with the Front Wall and  the 
>thumb rotates back towards the chest:
>


><< symbol.php.png >>


>
>
>The way we write the letter KJ without the arm is this way:
>


><< Picture18.png >>

This I knew... I wouldn't have had a problem without the arm! :-)
>
>The J hand starts with the finger up, and then the arm moves to be  
>parallel with the Floor and the Rotation itself is down and around...
>


><< symbol.php.png >>


>
>
>So this is one suggestion:
>
>


><< image.php.png >>


>
>
>There are other ways too I am sure...we just need to find a better  way 
>with a correct Rotation Symbol and Palm Facing...
>
>
>Val ;-)

I agree... but might I ask, is there any way to show that the left arm is 
actually extending away from the body, rather than straight across it?

As you pointed out, a "J" in regular fingerspelling involves movement of the 
whole arm.  The "J" in my sign name is only a wrist flip, similar to the 
wrist movement for "blue" or "yellow".  I guess I just used the same 
rotation symbol that I know belongs with the fingerspelled "J", even though 
the movement is different.

Looking forward to the discussion... I'll probably be posting another 
attempt or two myself...
KJ
>
>--------
>
>
>
>On May 1, 2007, at 5:48 AM, Charles Butler wrote:
>
>>I find this easy to read, the brush contact is the equivalent of a  
>>contact star, and the movement is placed for reading convenience  below 
>>the arm line.  That's how I would write an ASL "J" that  brushed the arm, 
>>else the movement would put the handshape too far  visually from the arm.
>>
>>Stefan Wöhrmann <stefanwoehrmann at GEBAERDENSCHRIFT.DE> wrote:
>>Hi Kelly,
>>
>>well - can you describe how to sign your signname?
>>
>><463177574000000>
>>
>>For some reason I do not know.
>>
>>First part no problem K-hand touches left lower arm ...
>>
>>your rotation arrow describes a movement of the right thumb, right  lower 
>>arm above or below the I-hand ? Now brush contact of the  little finger – 
>>lower arm above the hand ? hm --
>>
>>
>>Stefan ;-)
>>
>>
>>-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>Von: owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu [mailto:owner-sw- 
>>l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag von K.J. Boal
>>Gesendet: Dienstag, 1. Mai 2007 03:20
>>An: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>>Betreff: RE: AW: [sw-l] Sign Names in SignWriting ;-)
>>
>>Mine looks right!
>>KJ
>>
>>
>> >From: "Stefan Wöhrmann"<stefanwoehrmann at GEBAERDENSCHRIFT.DE>
>> >Reply-To: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>> >To: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>> >Subject: AW: [sw-l] Sign Names in SignWriting ;-)
>> >Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 00:19:09 +0200
>> >
>> >OK - attached you find the first snapshot of a table showing only  the 
>>names
>> >of the participants and their signnames - the way I understood  them, or 
>>got
>> >them ... ?
>> >
>> >If everything is ok - if there is no spelling problem I will go  forward 
>>to
>> >create a set of TT-Font symbols of these
>> >
>> >Next message will show the second part of the group
>> >
>> >(according the rule - one attachment with one message)
>> >
>> >Stefan ;-)
>> >
>> >-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>> >Von: owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>> >[mailto:owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag von  Valerie 
>>Sutton
>> >Gesendet: Montag, 30. April 2007 23:41
>> >An: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>> >Betreff: [sw-l] Sign Names in SignWriting ;-)
>> >
>> >SignWriting List
>> >April 30, 2007
>> >
>> >Stefan -
>> >Can you show us the sign names that you do have written already, and
>> >post them to the List? Then we all can have fun looking at them and
>> >checking them ;-)
>> >
>> >So go right ahead and post them to the List and then we can discuss
>> >reading everyone's names together to see if we understand the
>> >SignWriting...
>> >
>> >Thanks for doing this, Stefan...
>> >
>> >Val ;-)
>> >
>> >----------
>> >
>> >
>> >On Apr 30, 2007, at 1:45 PM, Stefan Wöhrmann wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hello Jonathan,
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > thanks for your kind words ...
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > well I finished a great table of all the people who showed  interest
>> > > in the handwriting course. – smile –
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > What is missing that we started to write our signnames by hand. My
>> > > idea has been to offer to you a TT Font showing your handwriting
>> > > and the computerprogram – spelling as you can get with  SignPuddle –
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Unfortunately we did never come so far to discuss our handwriting
>> > > of our signnames. Since it takes me quite a time to create the TT-
>> > > Font I really would prefer to do this job on a basis that the
>> > > spelling of the signnames are checked by Valerie –
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > What do you think ?
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Nice to read that you are still interested in this job which
>> > > already took quite a portion of time and concentration – smile
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > All the best
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Stefan ;-)
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Von: owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu [mailto:owner-sw-
>> > > l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag von Jonathan
>> > > Gesendet: Montag, 30. April 2007 21:07
>> > > An: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>> > > Betreff: [sw-l] Welcome back Stefan
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Welcome back Stefan!!!
>> > >
>> > > P.S. Did you finish the Sign names fonts you were working on?  Or
>> > > did that get put on the back burner now that we aren't currently
>> > > any lessons on the list?
>> > >
>> > > Jonathan
>> > >
>> > > Stefan Wöhrmann wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Hi Valerie, Cherie and listmembers –
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > well I am back online – smile –
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > You folks have been so incredible active! Too many messages – so
>> > > that I will need some time to catch up with what is discussed ...
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Looking at your video Cherie – I would write it this way
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > <image001.jpg>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > All the best
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Stefan
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Von: owner-sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu [mailto:owner-sw-
>> > > l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag von Cherie Wren
>> > > Gesendet: Samstag, 28. April 2007 16:52
>> > > An: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>> > > Betreff: Re: [sw-l] Shurley 4
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > I always have troubles with the rotations...  that is my signing,
>> > > not a transcription.  The two 'baby x's facing each other, then  the
>> > > right hand twists down twice and the left hand twists up twice
>> > > while the palms continue to face each other--  best way I can
>> > > describe it in words.  Here is a clip.
>> > >
>> > > ----- Original Message ----
>> > > From: "adam at frostvillage.com" <adam at frostvillage.com>
>> > > To: sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>> > > Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2007 1:05:09 AM
>> > > Subject: RE: [sw-l] Shurley 4
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Cherie,
>> > >
>> > > I was just reading your jingle. Very interesting. :-) Very well
>> > > written too. They only sign that I had a problem with was (I am
>> > > guessing) modify. The way that it was written is the same movement
>> > > that would be for a vertical "dead" or "opening the right door
>> > > while closing the left door." I took me a few tries of signing it
>> > > to see what you were saying. I think that the movement for modify
>> > > (at least the way I sign it) is the same as signing class except
>> > > the left hand goes the opposite way. I don't know if I am right in
>> > > my movement writing, but I was thinking that the movement was
>> > > better written this way. But if you are transcribing and the  person
>> > > signed it the way I mentioned before, then keep it. :-)
>> > >
>> > > Adam
>> > >
>> > > PS I'll try to get a clip of my signing the two movements as a
>> > > picture is worth a thousand words.
>> > >
>> > > Load message into SignText
>> > >
>> > > Courtesy of SignBank.org
>> > >
>> > > 337e55242c3367ad66f00b5c9bd745bb =  337e55242c3367ad66f00b5c9bd745bb
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
>> > > Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > >
>> > > Jonathan & Yolaine Duncan
>> > > 8-)  & ;-)
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >Val ;-)
>> >
>> >
>> >Valerie Sutton
>> >Sutton at SignWriting.org
>> >
>> >1. SignWriting
>> >Read & Write Sign Languages
>> >http://www.SignWriting.org
>> >
>> >2. SignBank
>> >Create Sign Language Databases
>> >http://www.SignBank.org
>> >
>> >3. SignPuddle
>> >Online Sign Language Community
>> >http://www.SignBank.org/signpuddle
>> >
>> >4. SignWriting List
>> >Technical Support: Ask questions to the List
>> >http://www.SignWriting.org/forums/swlist
>> >
>> >5. DanceWriting
>> >Read & Write Dance Movement
>> >http://www.DanceWriting.org
>> >
>> >6. MovementWriting
>> >Read & Write All Body Movement
>> >http://www.MovementWriting.org
>> >
>> >7. SymbolBank
>> >International Movement Writing Alphabet
>> >http://www.MovementWriting.org/symbolbank
>> >
>> >8. Non-profit Organization
>> >Center for Sutton Movement Writing
>> >http://www.SignWriting.org/forums/sponsors
>> >
>> >SignWriting Literature Project
>> >The DAC, Deaf Action Committee
>> >Center For Sutton Movement Writing
>> >an educational nonprofit organization
>> >P.O. Box 517, La Jolla, CA, 92038, USA
>> >tel 858-456-0098   fax 858-456-0020
>> >D-Link Videophone: 66.27.57.178
>> >Skype Name: valeriesutton
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> ><< tableofparticipantshandwritingcoursenamesandsignnames1.gif >>
>>
>>_________________________________________________________________
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>>
>

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