Animations to teach signwriting

Charles Butler chazzer3332000 at YAHOO.COM
Fri Jan 10 12:01:45 UTC 2014


I am truly amazed at the improvement in avatar programming since I first saw it modeled in a SWML project in Brazil in 2001. To have a full-time team working on animating the SW corpus is truly astonishing. If it is possible to interlink this program with the SignPuddles at some point in the future, it will truly be astounding to show the world how useful SW is as an everyday writing system that includes all of the parameters in the process. 

If one uses "confusao" and "complicado" in LIBRAS as examples, this would be an example the same handshapes connected in the same way where the only difference is speed of movement. 
 
Charles Butler
chazzer3332000 at yahoo.com
240-764-5748
Clear writing moves business forward.


________________________________
 From: André L <andre-andre at HOTMAIL.CA>
To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU 
Sent: Thursday, January 9, 2014 5:16 PM
Subject: Re: Animations to teach signwriting
 


 
 
The avatar is a 3D character that signs like a human.  Like from a video game.
 
It translates English, French, arabic writen texts by using SignWriting descriptions.
 
This is more powerful than animated gif.  The animated gif is closer from the written form.  That is why it can help learning to write.
 
Because the avatar and gif animation are competing solutions for almost the same needs, we need to discuss to put energy at the right place.  
 
The avatar already exists.  It has a huge team.
 
For more information about the avatar refer to the the tunisian                                                          team who                                                          worked on an                                                          avatar that                                                          translates SignWriting                                                          in a 3D                                                          animation.  Yosra                                                          Bouzid and                                                          Mohamed Jemni.

http://tiger.uvt.nl/pdf/papers/bouzid.pdf
http://www.utic.rnu.tn/francais/websign.html
 
I will try tomorrow to find the link were you can interact with the avatar.  I used it once.  It works for ASL, tunisian sign language and more...

 André Lemyre

________________________________
Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2014 11:09:38 -0800
From: freddyfingaz83 at YAHOO.COM
Subject: Re: Animations to teach signwriting
To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU


I would like to get my fact straight. In our vocabulary, Does avatar means 3d animated interpreter? If so, yes Im very interested to be involved however I feel animated signwriting should be different group away from 3d animated interpreter.  I do believe 3d animated will be more suffice because its most exciting for general average people. 
Dale Archuleta
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 



________________________________
 From:  André L <andre-andre at HOTMAIL.CA>; 
To:  <SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU>; 
Subject:  Re: Animations to teach signwriting 
Sent:  Thu, Jan 9, 2014 5:25:45 PM 


Bonjour Mohamed JEMNI,
Bonjour Yosra BOUZID,

il y a présentement une discussion sur le forum général de SignWriting sur la pertinence et la faisabilité d'utiliser des animations en format gif pour enseigner l'écriture de langue signées.  Ces animations mettaient en mouvement les symboles standard de SignWriting.  
 
Une extension de cette idée est d'intégrer ces animations dans les dictionnaires de SignWriting comme sign puddle.  Il serait alors possible de traduire automatiquement de longs textes en mode animation.  Ce concept est très proche de l'avatar que vous avez développé.
 
Pourriez-vous vous joindre à nous pour cette réflexion?
 
Merci
 
André Lemyre
 
En attachement vous trouverez les discussions précédentes et un exemple
 d'animation.
 


________________________________
Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2014 07:42:43 -0600
From: duncanjonathan at YAHOO.CA
Subject: Re: Animations to teach signwriting
To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU

Hi Andre,
    One of the great chanllenges of using the current software for
    animated GIFs is lining up one frame with the next. 
Your idea of all frames having head, is a good idea for a center,
    but if each GIF frame is a different size it will only be a little
    help for aligning them.  A solution with a fixed width and height
    per animation would be better (it could be different from one
    animation to another).

I was thinking on way would be to make a vertical line and a
    horizontal line in the SignWriting as a reference. It would be have
    to be big enough to fit all the animation we would want to write.
    All frames would come out the same size and everything would be
    referent (centered) to these lines.



M596x597S37a00403x404S37a00403x452S37a00403x500S37a00403x548S37a0e404x595S37a0e452x595S37a0e500x595S37a0e548x595

The down side is that you would have to manually take out the lines
    afterwards frame by frame.

Or

In SignWriter Studio these lines could even be white just like the
    background.  (Sorry no support for transparencies in SignWriter
    Studio at this time).  Then with a graphics program that does
    transparencies change the white to transparent.  Just don't use the
    same white (maybe an offwhite) for the hands as for the background
    and the lines.

Jonathan


On 1/8/2014 12:02 PM, André L wrote:

 
>Such an editor would take existing signs and allow manipulating them.  
>Example: Selecting a vertical hand would allow to puting it
        horizontal to illustrate a rotation...
> 
>Such software should not be coded too soon. People need to
        explore the possibilities.  The proof of concept is starting.
> 
>This is my current process.
>1- Import a dictionary in sign writer studio.
>2- Select a sign.
>3-Create a copy of the sign.
>4-Edit the sign by selecting symbols to duplicate or reposition.
>5-If necessary add a head.  This defines where the hands will be
        located.
>6-Copy paste an image of signwriter studio in pain.
>7-Resize the paint display.
>-----transparency setting would come here----
>8-Create several copies of the written sign.
>9-Edit each file with the same name and a counter (file 0 is the
        original written sign with extra transition symbols).  The head
        is my origin.  It should not move.
>10-Feed the files in a gif animator.
> 
> 
>
>
>________________________________
>Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2014 09:43:06 -0800
>From: freddyfingaz83 at YAHOO.COM
>Subject: Re: Animations to teach signwriting
>To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU
>
>
>Yes, it sound like we will need to developing "Animated Signwriting Creator" software where it automatically set up rules and grids template screen to positioning loops cycle for us to follow to prevent errors. And capacity to format transparent background
>Dale Archuleta
>Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
>
>
>
>________________________________
> From:  André L <andre-andre at HOTMAIL.CA>; 
>To:  <SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU>; 
>Subject:  Re: Animations to teach signwriting 
>Sent:  Wed, Jan 8, 2014 5:25:35 PM 
>
>
>I agree with you that mixing signwriting and videos will become an habit in some future.  The need cannot be delayed, we would have to redo much work.
> 
>The template window frame for the gif may be
                          big.  We must allow the character to extend 
                          left and right arms.  That would make a huge
                          white square on top of a video.  Transparency
                          would hide less of the content.
>Another example would be animated cartoons.
> 
>André Lemyre
>
> 
>
>
>________________________________
>Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2014 07:31:07 -0800
>From: freddyfingaz83 at YAHOO.COM
>Subject: Re: Animations to teach signwriting
>To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU
>
>
>Andre Lemyre
>There are several reasons why transparent background is needed but it is not required. One of examples, if I want to put animated signwriting on the pictures or videos on fixed opacity transparent background to easy on eyes comfort to reading without colors inpurterted matched colors. It would be lot of work if I have to modify GIFS personally. I'm sure some of people has other reasons.
>Dale Archuleta
>Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
>
>
>
>________________________________
> From:  André L <andre-andre at HOTMAIL.CA>; 
>To:  <SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU>; 
>Subject:  Re: Animations to teach signwriting 
>Sent:  Wed, Jan 8, 2014 12:15:57 PM 
>
>
>Do you have an example of a need to overlay a sign to something else?
>I think that I saw a free
                                            gif animator 10 years ago
                                            that supported transparent
                                            beackground.
>I will do a research.
> 
>André Lemyre
> 
>
>
>________________________________
>Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2014 21:03:14 -0800
>From: freddyfingaz83 at YAHOO.COM
>Subject: Re: Animations to
                                              teach signwriting
>To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU
>
>
>Hello 
>I understood most Editors programs doesn't supports transparent backgrounds. I feel its very important to have entirely transparent background because it's able to overlays anything without modification. 
>Dale Archuleta 
>Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
>
>
>
>________________________________
> From:  André L <andre-andre at HOTMAIL.CA>; 
>To:  <SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU>; 
>Subject:  Re: Animations to teach signwriting 
>Sent:  Wed, Jan 8, 2014 4:23:30 AM 
>
>
> 
>Hello,
> 
>I agree with a reserve.
>We may want
                                                          the white
                                                          surfaces of
                                                          the hands and
                                                          the face to
                                                          remain white
                                                          if we display
                                                          the animation
                                                          on a coloured
                                                          background. 
                                                          Also, in my
                                                          first 
                                                          attempts I
                                                          used Microsoft
                                                          paint, which
                                                          does not
                                                          support
                                                          transparent
                                                          background. 
                                                          Considering
                                                          that dictionnaries
                                                          have between
                                                          1000 and 5000
                                                          words, and
                                                          there are
                                                          several
                                                          contributors,
                                                          we need to
                                                          ensure ease of
                                                          creation to
                                                          make this
                                                          project grow. 
                                                          Standards will
                                                          be important
                                                          to avoid
                                                          redoing the
                                                          work when
                                                          someone finds
                                                          a better way
                                                          to proceed.
> 
>Also, I will
                                                          contact soon
                                                          the tunisian
                                                          team who
                                                          worked on an
                                                          avatar that
                                                          translates SignWriting
                                                          in a 3D
                                                          animation.   I
                                                          would start
                                                          with  Yosra
                                                          Bouzid and
                                                          Mohamed Jemni.
>http://tiger.uvt.nl/pdf/papers/bouzid.pdf
>http://www.utic.rnu.tn/francais/websign.html
>
>Conceptually,
                                                          our doing gif
                                                          animation is a
                                                          subset of what
                                                          the avatar
                                                          does in an
                                                          automated
                                                          manner.  The
                                                          avatar may be
                                                          able to write
                                                          the gif
                                                          animations in
                                                          an automated
                                                          manner on a
                                                          large scale. 
                                                          I such
                                                          scenario would
                                                          happen, our
                                                          best input may
                                                          become to
                                                          increase the
                                                          dictionnaries
                                                          size to "feed"
                                                          the avatar or
                                                          to help it
                                                          with
                                                          directional
                                                          words
                                                          (example: I
                                                          give you, you
                                                          give me). 
> 
>Concertation will be important before going any further.
> 
>André Lemyre
>
>
>________________________________
>Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2014 19:39:37 -0800
>From: freddyfingaz83 at YAHOO.COM
>Subject: Re:
                                                          Animations to
                                                          teach
                                                          signwriting
>To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU
>
>
>I also agreed rules needs to be applied before processing the animated dictionary. Such as size, resolute, aligned positioning, etc... I would like offer to add other rule. All GIFS should have transparent backgrounds. In a case, we will not need to reformat entire dictionary in future use. 
>Dale Archuleta
>Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
>
>
>
>________________________________
> From:  André L <andre-andre at HOTMAIL.CA>; 
>To:  <SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU>; 
>Subject:  Re: Animations to teach signwriting 
>Sent:  Tue, Jan 7, 2014 1:57:39 AM 
>
>
>Hello Jonathan and Valerie,
> 
>I would prefer
                                                          to have the
                                                          animations with
                                                          the regular
                                                          dictionaries ,
                                                          just like the
                                                          optional illustration
                                                          or video but
                                                          distinct.
>In a distant
                                                          future, the
                                                          translate
                                                          feature could
                                                          concatenate
                                                          the animations
                                                          in long
                                                          stories.
> 
>I will spend
                                                          some time
                                                          preparing
                                                          samples of
                                                          animations to
                                                          see how
                                                          symbols could
                                                          be used (good
                                                          and bad
                                                          examples).  I
                                                          will provide
                                                          several
                                                          alternatives
                                                          for people to
                                                          compare.  I
                                                          will make a
                                                          document to
                                                          open a
                                                          discussion
                                                          establish some
                                                          standards (not
                                                          my personal
                                                          preferences). 
                                                          We do not want
                                                          an animation
                                                          of several
                                                          words being
                                                          misaligned,
                                                          shrinking and
                                                          growing with
                                                          blinking 
                                                          fuzzy heads
                                                          with several
                                                          file formats
                                                          and
                                                          resolution.  
> 
>We will need
                                                          the opinion of
                                                          Deaf people,
                                                          programmers,
                                                          teachers,
                                                           SignWriters,
                                                          children and
                                                          teenagers for
                                                          an acceptance
                                                          test.  Speed
                                                          will be an
                                                          issue, I
                                                          expect Deaf
                                                          people and
                                                          fluent
                                                          signwriters to
                                                          prefer fast
                                                          videos (i.e.
                                                          at a signing
                                                          speed) while
                                                          beginners will
                                                          be lost.  
> 
>André Lemyre
> 
>
> 
>
>
>________________________________
>Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2014 17:34:07 -0800
>From: signwriting at MAC.COM
>Subject: Re:
                                                          Animations to
                                                          teach
                                                          signwriting
>To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU
>
>SignWriting
                                                          List 
>January 6, 2014
>
>
>Thank you, Jonathan!
>
>
>Val ;-)
>
>
>——
>
>
>
>
>On Jan 6, 2014, at 4:27 PM, Jonathan Duncan <duncanjonathan at yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
>Hi Val, 
>>    With a few
                                                          small
                                                          modifications
                                                          SignWriter
                                                          Studio should
                                                          be able to
                                                          store and
                                                          display
                                                          animated
                                                          GIFs.  Sounds
                                                          like an
                                                          exciting
                                                          project!! :-)   
>>    I would be
                                                          glad to update
                                                          SignWriter
                                                          Studio so that
                                                          it have the
                                                          animations.
>>Jonathan
>>
>>
>>On 1/6/2014 4:01 PM, Valerie Sutton wrote:
>>
>>SignWriting List 
>>>January 6, 2014
>>>
>>>
>>>Hello André!
>>>Thank you for this message and for the attached PowerPoint - It is good to know that PowerPoint can accept animated GIFs. It looks great!
>>>
>>>
>>>I agree that animated SignWriting is valuable as an educational tool…I think others agree too -
>>>
>>>
>>>Would you, or anyone else, be interested in working on a new project…an Animated SignWriting Dictionary on the web?
>>>
>>>
>>>Take a look at this web page:
>>>
>>>
>>>http://www.movementwriting.org/animation/sgn-US/
>>>
>>>
>>>It is a simple page that shows the sign written in SignWriting, and to the right of the sign, is the animated version of it…
>>>
>>>
>>>We could have an entire site devoted to this Animated SignWriting Dictionary and Animated SignWriting Literature idea…
>>>
>>>
>>>It could be a relaxed project for fun with no deadlines or any pressure at all (I do not like deadlines or pressure ;-) 
>>>
>>>
>>>Just whenever the whim hits, do a few animations, and save them in a file. Then we can post them in a new site...
>>>
>>>
>>>The project could be done for any sign language, and essentially be like a SignPuddle Online but for animated signs -
>>>
>>>
>>>And that brings up the next question….Steve and Jonathan…could SignPuddle and SignWriter Studio store animated GIFs?
>>>
>>>
>>>Val ;-)
>>>
>>>
>>>-------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On Jan 6, 2014, at 9:50 AM, André L <andre-andre at hotmail.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>Hello,
>>>>Animations
                                                          might be an
                                                          intuitive way
                                                          to teach
                                                          signwriting to
                                                          deaf children.
>>>>It uses their
                                                          knowledge of
                                                          sign language.
>>>>The movements
                                                          make the
                                                          writing more
                                                          intuitive,
                                                          closer to
                                                          their
                                                          experience.
>>>>There are less
                                                          symbols to
                                                          read at once.
>>>>It is easy to
                                                          display on a
                                                          screen, a
                                                          computer or on
                                                          paper.
>>>>A teacher can
                                                          write on a
                                                          slide with the
                                                          mouse during
                                                          the class.
>>>>It is possible
                                                          to create a
                                                          power point
                                                          show (does not
                                                          require power
                                                          point to be
                                                          displayed).
>>>> 
>>>>Here is an
                                                          example of one
                                                          animated
                                                          word.  It
                                                          could be a
                                                          sentence, a
                                                          small movie...
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>André Lemyre
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>
________________________________________________ 
>>>>SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>>>>Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org
>>>>Post Messages to the SignWriting List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu
>>>>SignWriting List Archives & Home Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist
>>>>Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1 
________________________________________________ 
>>>
>>>
SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
>>>Valerie Sutton
                                                          SignWriting
                                                          List moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>>>Post Messages
                                                          to the
                                                          SignWriting
                                                          List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>>>SignWriting
                                                          List Archives
                                                          & Home
                                                          Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>>>Join, Leave or
                                                          Change How You
                                                          Receive SW
                                                          List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>________________________________________________ 
>>>
>>>
SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
>>>Valerie Sutton
                                                          SignWriting
                                                          List moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>>>Post Messages
                                                          to the
                                                          SignWriting
                                                          List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>>>SignWriting
                                                          List Archives
                                                          & Home
                                                          Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>>>Join, Leave or
                                                          Change How You
                                                          Receive SW
                                                          List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
________________________________________________ 
>>>
>>>
SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
>>>Valerie Sutton
                                                          SignWriting
                                                          List moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>>>Post Messages
                                                          to the
                                                          SignWriting
                                                          List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>>>SignWriting
                                                          List Archives
                                                          & Home
                                                          Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>>>Join, Leave or
                                                          Change How You
                                                          Receive SW
                                                          List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1 
>>>
>>
>>
>>-- 
>> 
>________________________________________________ SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>Post Messages
                                                          to the
                                                          SignWriting
                                                          List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>SignWriting
                                                          List Archives
                                                          & Home
                                                          Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>Join, Leave or
                                                          Change How You
                                                          Receive SW
                                                          List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1
>
>
> 
>________________________________________________ SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
>Valerie Sutton
                                                  SignWriting List
                                                  moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>Post Messages to the
                                                  SignWriting List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>SignWriting List
                                                  Archives & Home
                                                  Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>Join, Leave or Change
                                                  How You Receive SW
                                                  List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1
>
> 
>________________________________________________ SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
>Valerie Sutton
                              SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>Post Messages to the SignWriting List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>SignWriting List Archives & Home Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW
                              List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1
>
> 
________________________________________________ SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
>Valerie Sutton
            SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>Post Messages to the SignWriting List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>SignWriting List Archives & Home Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1
>
>
________________________________________________ 
>SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
>Valerie Sutton
        SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org 
>Post Messages to the SignWriting List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
>SignWriting List Archives & Home Page http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
>Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1 
>

-- 
 
 email: duncanjonathan at yahoo.ca
         joyoduncan at gmail.com
Cel Honduras: (504)3141-1171
Tel USA: (347)875-8442 
Skype: yojoduncan

SignWriter Studio

________________________________________________ SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
Valerie Sutton
SignWriting List moderator
sutton at signwriting.org 
Post Messages to the SignWriting List:
sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
SignWriting List Archives & Home Page
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages
http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1

 
________________________________________________ 
SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
Valerie Sutton
SignWriting List moderator
sutton at signwriting.org 
Post Messages to the SignWriting List:
sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
SignWriting List Archives & Home Page
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages
http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1

________________________________________________ 
SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION 
Valerie Sutton
SignWriting List moderator
sutton at signwriting.org 
Post Messages to the SignWriting List:
sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu 
SignWriting List Archives & Home Page
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist 
Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages
http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1

________________________________________________


SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION

Valerie Sutton
SignWriting List moderator
sutton at signwriting.org

Post Messages to the SignWriting List:
sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu

SignWriting List Archives & Home Page
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist

Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages
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