[Sw-l] Request for guidance - Aesthetic symbols for writing name sign (People's own sign)

Tue Jul 16 17:03:25 UTC 2019

SignWriting List
July 16, 2019

Hello Rubens and Steve, Adam, and Lucia -

Thank you, Rubens, for this discussion and thank you for posting on the SignWriting List. I enjoyed reading your name signs with the eyelashes and smiles in your attached files.

In the past, there have been sign language researchers who studied how names in sign languages are constructed and some of this research points to specific rules that govern how name signs should look. For example, if you go to Google and search for "research on Name Signs in sign languages" you will find many links to information on the subject.

But as Adam says, there are two groups of thinking on this, and the more flexible approach probably is the most reasonable. Freedom to write and express yourself as you wish will probably win - smile - for example - I like smiles too! ;-)

Write as you feel is best, but keep connected here on the SignWriting List for further information as people write and post -

Years ago, when we started writing children's stories in ASL here in our own SignWriting organization, the Deaf author of Goldilocks received criticism for placing smiling faces all over the Goldilocks Level 2 reading book. We were told by this one critic that smiling faces were not linguistically needed in most of the examples. But our author felt that Deaf children will respond to learning to read the children's stories better, if the smiling faces are there, especially for the name sign for Goldilocks ;-)

So thanks for the post, Ruben!

Val ;-)

------------

On Jul 16, 2019, at 8:53 AM, Lucia Garcia <luciagarcialibras at GMAIL.COM> wrote:

Olá Rubens, achei interessante essa ideia, vou começar a usar cílios para identificar os gêneros

Muito obrigada  pela dica.

Lucia Garcia

------------------

On Jul 16, 2019, at 8:47 AM, Adam Frost <icemandeaf at GMAIL.COM> wrote:

Hello Rubens,

You aren’t the first to ask about this question, and I am sure you won’t be the last. ;-)

I have seen two troupes on this issue. One who feels that name signs should be distinguishable. The other who feels if name signs aren’t distinguishable with live signing, why should they be with the written form. I am personally in the latter troupe; however, I will give you a neutral viewpoint to answer your question of how to distinguish name signs in written form.

When proposing ways to quickly identify name signs in a written form, there have generally been two proposals. The first is by adding a specific symbol to the name sign, such as a line under it as proposed by Stefan Wöhrmann from Germany. Attached here is his own name sign using his line symbol to mean name signs.

The second proposal is what you have proposed. In fact, the use of facial expressions with name signs such as smiles, eyes, and eyebrows has been proposed several times. Some have even proposed adding (long) hair to farther distinguish gender. Just a side of caution, heavy use of facial expressions to identify name signs may cause problems when actual facial expressions are needed for other grammar or narrative purposes.

In the end, it is really up to the writer to make such a decision. And by extension, the writer’s community will establish the norm. I know that Brazil has many writers and several more written documents of their own. I would not be surprised if the Brazilian SignWriting community would come up with their own standard on this issue. And it doesn’t have to be the same standard that is used in other places (like America or German). Such is the freedom that is gained by writing your own language.

Adam

-------------------

> On Jul 15, 2019, at 8:10 PM, Stephen Slevinski <slevin at signpuddle.net> wrote:
> 
> Hi Rubens Almeida,
> 
> I do not believe we have any material that covers name signs specifically.
> 
> However, I think using aesthetics for name signs is a fine idea.  Writing sign language is relatively new.  If people like the idea, it will spread.  All conventions need to start somewhere.
> 
> Regards,
> -Steve

----------

> On Jul 15, 2019, at 11:34 PM, Rubens Almeida <rubens.escritadesinais at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> 
> Members of the deaf community who use SignWriting around the world.
> 
> I would like the help of you, I have the privilege of writing the name of the sign (Sign of person - baptism in Libras) of many people in SignWriting here in Brazil, and to show that it is sign name specifically, I have using symbols of "Aesthetics" representing eyes, eyelashes, mouth or other symbols on the face, according to the following symbols available in SignPuddle (attachment).
> 
> I believe that using these symbols to write the name sign (a person's own sign) can contribute and facilitate reading, because it gives tips for the reader to "prepare" to encounter an unusual or specific sign, which you probably will not know it in advance and need to analyze it more carefully. (CARNEIRO, 2018)
> Another reason is also to differentiate similar signs from people of Male and Female genres with the same signs, so using a symbol with eyelashes can differentiate from the other that does not have it, showing the difference of genres.
> I have already written the deaf with the same sign, more male and female.
> See example (attachment)
> 
> I am writing a children's book in SignWriting and in it I make use of sign name (baptism in Libras) with characters with the same sign gender name (male and female) different, in the same context, in this way, write using the symbols of aesthetics certainly facilitates the reading, for identifying and differentiating the characters with the same signs.
> So I'm posting on this list, with the aim of asking for help with opinions, guidelines about what you have accomplished, your experiences in this area, also with references of publications (magazines, books, memos, web, sites, symposia) that address this subject.
> Thank you very much for your attention and support in this important work developed here in Brazil.
> 
> Regards,
> - Rubens Almeida
> SEDUC/MA, Brazil
> 
> 
> ________________________________________________
> 
> 
> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
> 
> Valerie Sutton
> SignWriting List moderator
> sutton at signwriting.org
> 
> Post Messages to the SignWriting List:
> sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu
> 
> SignWriting List Archives & Home Page
> http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist
> 
> Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages
> http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1

________________________________________________

SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION

Valerie Sutton
SignWriting List moderator
sutton at signwriting.org

Post Messages to the SignWriting List:
sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu

SignWriting List Archives & Home Page
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist

Join, Leave or Change How You Receive SW List Messages
http://listserv.valenciacollege.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=SW-L&A=1
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment.htm>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: Stefan Wo?hrmann.png
Type: image/png
Size: 2113 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment.png>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment-0001.htm>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: Vera Thomas.png
Type: image/png
Size: 572 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment-0001.png>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment-0002.htm>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: namesign.png
Type: image/png
Size: 440 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment-0002.png>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment-0003.htm>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: Questionamento sobre o uso estil?stico dos grafemas (Texto para os membros do Forum mundial SignWriting).pdf
Type: application/pdf
Size: 210990 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment.pdf>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20190716/35ae3914/attachment-0004.htm>