Arabic-L:LINGE:Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Responses
Dilworth B. Parkinson
Dilworth_Parkinson at byu.edu
Fri Nov 2 15:22:27 UTC 2001
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1) Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
2) Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
3) Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
4) Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
5) Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
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1)
Date: 02 Nov 2001
From: DLNewman <d.newman at planetinternet.be>
Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
Hello,
For more information on Sa'idi dialects, I suggest you consult the following
works:
- BEHNSTEDT, Peter & Manfred WOIDICH (1985-87): Die ägyptisch-arabischen
Dialekte, 3 vols (+ Dialektatlas), Wiesbaden: Dr. Ludwig Reichert. This
vital reference work on Egyptian dialects also contains a separate volume on
Upper Egyptian.
- DAWOOD, T. H. O. M. (1949): The phonetics of the Il-Karnak dialect (Upper
Egypt), Unpubl. M. A. thesis, University of London (SOAS).
- DOSS, M. (1981): Le dialecte Sa'idi de la Région de Menya, Unpubl. PhD
(thèse 3ème cycle), Université de Paris III.
- KHALAFALLAH, Abdelghany A. (1969): A descriptive grammar of SaE i:di
Egyptian Colloquial Arabic, (Janua Linguarum, Series Practica, XXXIX), The
Hague/Paris (Mouton).
- KHALAFALLAH, A. A. (1959): Some phonological problems involved in the
learning of English by native speakers of Sa'i:di Colloquial Egyptian
Arabic, Unpubl. M.A. thesis, University of Texas.
- MASLUH, S. A. A. (1968); Dirasa li-lahjaat al-Minyaa fi daw'
al-jughrafiyaa al-lughawiyya, Unpubl. M. A. thesis, Dar al-Ulum, University
of Cairo.
- NISHIO, Tetsuo (1994): The Arabic dialect of Qift (Upper Egypt). Grammar
and Classified vocabulary, Tokyo: Institute for the Study of Languages and
Cultures of Asia and Africa.
WAHAB, G. A. (1983): Etudes contrastives du Français standard du vocalisme
et du dialecte de Minia (Haute-Egypte), Unpubl. PhD (thèse 3ème cycle),
Université de Paris III.
WOIDICH, Manfred (1973-4): "Die 3. Person feminin Singular Perfekt in dem
oberägyptischen Dialekt von Il-Bi'rat", Mélanges de l'Université de
Saint-Joseph, pp. 357-72.
WOIDICH, Manfred (1974): Ein arabischer Bauerndialekt aus dem südlichen
Oberägypten", ZDMG, 124, 1, pp. 42-58.
Other useful information can also be gleaned from the following:
- AMMAR, H. (1954): Growing up in an Egyptian village (Silwa, Province of
Aswan), London.
- BLACKMAN, W. (1927): The Fellahin of Upper Egypt, London.
- DULAC, H. (1885): 'Contes arabes en dialecte de la Haute-Egypte", Journal
Asiatique, VIIIè série, 5, pp. 5-38.
- LEGRAIN, G. (1912): "Chansons dans les ruines", La Revue Egyptienne, 1,
10-11, 5 October, pp. 307-10.
- LEGRAIN, G. (1912): "Légendes, coutûmes et chansons populaires du Saïd",
La Revue Egyptienne, 1, pp. 171-81, 205-11, 243-45, 269-76, 300-7, 345-58.
- MASPERO, G. (1914): "Chansons populaires recueillis dans la Haute-Egypte
de 1900 à 1914 pendant les inspections du service des antiquités", Annales
du Service des Antiquités de l'Egypte, 14, pp. 97-290.
- SPITTA BEY,G. (1883): Contes arabes modernes, Leiden/Paris.
These are, to the best of my knowledge, the only works that deal
specifically with Upper Egyptian (Sa'idi) dialects. As for your other
questions:
1. I have not found any records of the literary use of these dialects.
2. Though the dialects do occur in dialogues in modern Egyptian literature
(as well as films, where there is often a 'token' Sa'idi; e.g. the
blockbuster 'Irhab wa kebab'), there are no newspapers published in any of
them. Songs are a far more prolific source, however, and there is a lot of
Sa'idi music (including folk songs) available on audiotapes in Egypt (though
I would imagine mainly in the south!).
3. There is unfortunately no institute for the promotion of Sa'idi.
Hope this is of some use to you.
Kind regards,
Daniel Newman
P.S.: I myself have for a number of years conducted research into the
phonetics and phonology of Southern Sa'idi dialects (in the Luxor area),
some of which I hope to publish in the not too distant future (insha'Allah).
Let me know if you are interested.
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2)
Date: 02 Nov 2001
From: Albrecht Hofheinz <Albrecht_Hofheinz at web.de>
Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
If you have any additions, please reply not only to the list, but
also to directly to Antonio Caridad [mailto:acaridad at wanadoo.es].
On 01.11.2001 at 13:18 Uhr -0700, Antonio Caridad wrote:
>Date: 01 Nov 2001
>From: acaridad at wanadoo.es
>Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects query
>I write you because I`m very interested in history of arabic
>dialects, specially in those of Southern Egypt (saidi) and Sudan.
>Could you answer my questions about this subject?
I will only deal with Sudanese Arabic, and not aim for any
completeness, i.a. since I do not have easy access to my library at
present.
>- When were made the first dictionaries and grammars of each one of
>these dialects? who wrote them?
1923: (al-shaykh) 3abd allaah 3abd al-raHmaan al-amiin: al-3arabiyya
fii al-suudaan. Khartoum. Re-ed. Beirut: daar al-kitaab al-lubnaanii,
1967.
1925: Hillelson, Samuel: Sudan-Arabic. English-Arabic vocabulary.
London: Sudan Government. xxvi, 341 pp. 2nd edn. London
1930. (Based on the English-Arabic Vocabulary by Harold François
Saphir Amery).
1925: Worsley, Allan: Sudanese Grammar. London: Society for Promoting
Christian Knowlege. vi, 80 pp. (dialect of Omdurman).
1946: Trimingham, John Spencer: Sudan colloquial Arabic. London:
Oxford University Press, G. Cumberlege, 1946. viii, 176 p. "The first
edition [published by the Church missionary society in 1939] was
based largely upon W.H.T. Gairdner's Egyptian Colloquial Arabic. The
present edition has been completely rewritten and some four-fifths of
the material is entirely new" (pref. to 2d edn.).
1965: Awn al-Sharif Gasim: "Some aspects of Sudanese colloquial
Arabic". Sudan Notes and Records, 46, pp. 40-49.
1966: 3abd al-majiid 3aabidiin: min uSuul al-lahajaat al-3arabiyya
fii al-suudaan: diraasa muqaarana fii al-lahajaat al-3arabiyya
wa-atharihaa fii al-suudaan. Cairo: maktabat ghariib, 1966. 138 pp.
1969-72: Roth, Arlette: Lexique des parlers arabes tchado-soudanais.
An Arabic-English-French lexicon of the dialects spoken in the
Chad-Sudan area. Paris, Editions du Centre national de la recherche
scientifique. 4 vols.
1972: 3awn al-shariif qaasim: qaamuus al-lahja al-3aammiyya fii
al-suudaan. Khartoum: shu3bat abHaath al-suudaan bi-jaami3at
al-khurTuum, with al-majlis al-qawmii li-ri3aayat al-aadaab
wal-funuun. 2nd impr. Cairo: al-maktab al-miSrii al-Hadiith, 1985.
(the definitive dictionary)
1973: Crewe, William James: The place of Sudanese Arabic: a study in
comparative Arabic dialectology. Khartum: Institute of African and
Asian Studies, University of Khartoum. 18 ff. (African and Asian
studies seminar series; 20).
1976: Kaye, Alan S.: Chadian and Sudanese Arabic in the light of
comparative Arabic dialectology. The Hague: Mouton, 1976. xv, 212
pp. (Janua linguarum: Series practica; 236).
1980: Persson, Andrew & Janet Persson with Ahmad Hussein: Sudanese
colloquial Arabic for beginners. High Wycombe, England: Summer
Institute of Linguistics. viii, 272 pp.
1983: Ushari Ahmad Mahmud: Arabic in the southern Sudan: history and
spread of a pidgin-creole. Khartoum: FAL Advertising and Print. Co.
xiii, 168 pp.
1983: Prokosch, Erich: Osmanisches Wortgut im Sudan-Arabischen.
Berlin: Klaus Schwarz. 75 pp. (Islamkundliche Untersuchungen; 89)
1983: Reichmuth, Stefan: Der arabische Dialekt der Sukriyya im
Ostsudan. Hildesheim & New York: G. Olms. ix, 309 pp. (Studien zur
Sprachwissenschaft; 2). Originally presented as the author's doctoral
thesis, Freie Universität Berlin.
>- Have these dialects been used at any time during their history, as
>literary languages? there are any book or newspaper written in these
>dialects?
The influence of Sudanese colloquial Arabic is noticeable already in
the first surviving written records we have from the Sudan and which
go back to the 18th c.
The earliest published printed source where Sudanese colloquial
Arabic is used occasionally is
ca. 1804: muHammad al-nuur wad Dayf allaah: kitaab al-Tabaqaat fii
khuSuuS al-awliyaa' wal-3ulamaa' wal-shu3araa' fii al-suudaan. Best
edn. ed. yuusuf faDl Hasan, Khartoum: Khartoum University Press, 1971
(2nd edn. ib, 1974; 3rd edn. ib., 1985).
There is a very rich literary tradition of Sudanese Arabic colloquial
poetry that we can trace back to the 18th and 19th centuries (no
earlier sources have survived). The 20th c. has seen the literary use
of SCA in song, theatre plays, novels, collections of folklore, etc.
All this is much too rich to be listed here. As an entry point, you
may consult
Arabic Literature of Africa, Vol. I: The Writings of Eastern Sudanic
Africa to c. 1900. Compiled by R.S. O¹Fahey with the assistance of
Muhammad Ibrahim Abu Salim, Albrecht Hofheinz, Yahya Muhammad
Ibrahim, Bernd Radtke and Knut S. Vikør. Leiden: Brill, 1994
(Handbuch der Orientalistik, Erste Abteilung: Der Nahe und Mittlere
Osten, Bd. 13) (see
http://www.brill.nl/catalogue/productinfo.asp?product=446). An
Arabic translation of this, publ. London: Al Furqan, is in press.
A more recent phenomenon is the use of Sudanese colloquial Arabic on
the Internet: In the discussion forum Sudan.Net Notice and Discussion
Board
(http://www.sudanforum.net/cgi-bin/discussion/view.pl?board=sgdb) it
is used as least as often as, if not more frequently than, MSA.
>- Does it exist any institution created to promote the use of these
>dialects? when was it founded?
I am not aware of any institution specifically devoted to that task,
but literary societies, academic centres, radio and television etc.
do of course cover similar ground.
>- Which influences have received these dialects throughout its
>history? from which languages or dialects? at which centuries?
Sudanese Arabic is commonly grouped together with Egyptian Arabic
into one family. There are certainly connections to the Arabian
peninsula as well. There are influences from indigenous languages
such as Nubian, and later from Ottoman Turkish, colonial British
English, Egyptian Arabic, international English, etc. Very
interesting are also processes of the pidginization and even
creolization of Arabic in the Southern Sudan and northern Uganda. A
vast field!
>Please, ask as many questions as you can. It`s so difficult to get
>information about this subject.
>
>If you could give the name or e-mail address of any expert in
>sudanese or saidi arabic, I would be also very happy.
Search the web for
Institute of African and Asian Studies, University of Khartoum
Awn al-Sharif Qasim
Ushari Ahmad Mahmud
al-Tayyib Muhammad al-Tayyib
Stefan Reichmuth
Catherine Miller
...
>I wait for your answer
>Best regards
>Antonio Caridad [mailto:acaridad at wanadoo.es]
Best wishes,
Albrecht Hofheinz
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3)
Date: 02 Nov 2001
From: "Schub, Michael" <michael.schub at trincoll.edu>
Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
See Khalafallah, Abdelghany A. *A Grammar of Saeedi Egyptian
Colloquial Arabic* Mouton, 1969 The Hague, Paris.
Lib. Congress #68-17886.
Best wishes,
Mike Schub
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4)
Date: 02 Nov 2001
From: Mutarjm at aol.com
Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
Two sources you might contact:
1. Dr. Alan S. Kaye the Dept of English & Linguistsics at California
State University, Fullerton (go to < www.fullerton.edu > and navigate
therein).
He has done field research and written about Sudanese-Chadian
dialects of Arabic (I don't know about Sa9idii Egyptian).
2. The Institute of African and Asian Languages (might be Asian &
African) at University of Khartoum published some descriptive
monographs about Sudanese Arabic in the 1980s.
I have some materials (basic textbook, no historical or detailed
academic treatment; Arabic-text entries are handwritten and
colloquial) published in 1979 by the Summer Institute of Linguistics
when it had a field office in Khartoum.
Two publsihed referenecs:
1. Back issue of Sudan Notes and Records (SNR)
2. Academy of Sciences: In the mid-1970s, the Oriental Institute
(Moscow/Tashkent joint opus) of the Academy of Sciences of the former
Soviet Union published a detailed (!!) descriptive work, in Russian
and with Arabic text entries, on the Sa3idi/Upper Nile dialect.
HTH. Good luck.
Regards from Los Angeles,
Stephen H. Franke
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5)
Date: 02 Nov 2001
From: Rahel Halabe <rahel at telus.net>
Subject: Southern Egyptian and Sudanese Dialects Response
Antonio,
Answering the second question: The Sudanese author AlTayyeb Salih certainly
uses Sudanese Arabic dialect in dialog in his novels.
Rahel
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