siwash cosho for "seal"

Tue Sep 21 21:44:43 UTC 2004

I don't have much more information on the word break down for
k'ash-ch'u/(u); I think it is it's own word in and of itself, but it does
have a combining form that looks like  k'ashch'uq-  when combining it with
other suffixes like k'ashch'uq w iks  eating harbor/hair seal.
Maybe the term siwash cosho was coined because of how seal blubber and pork
fat were rendered; after seal or whale blubber is rendered it can then be
smoked and eaten, probably similar to fried pork rinds.
Maria

-----Original Message-----
From: The Chinook List [mailto:CHINOOK at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG]On Behalf
Of Scott Tyler
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 6:32 PM
To: CHINOOK at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
Subject: Re: siwash cosho for "seal"

k'ash-ch'u  means  seal in Makah and is Makah, don't think it is a borrowed
word.
And I am not sure how the parts fit together
 ch'u can be used for things that smell bad, but I do not know if this is
correct for seal.
Maria might know how this is put together for seal.
 a wolf is  ch'u ch'u waX siL = bad breath in mouth,
Scott

----- Original Message -----
From: "Leanne Riding" <riding at TIMETEMPLE.COM>
To: <CHINOOK at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG>
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 1:58 PM
Subject: Re: siwash cosho for "seal"

> I was wondering, is k'ash-ch'u a makah word, also what does it mean?
>
> Here's some miscellaneous unimportant info about seals and pigs
> that you might find interesting:
>
> 1) A while back we talked about an instance where an old CJ
> dictionaries defined "ole hiyu" as a sea wolf, or seal. A day or
> two ago while reading the french version of Gabriele Franchere's
> journal, I noticed that he called the seal a "loup-marin" (sea
> wolf).
>
> 2) Concerning pigs at Astoria, Gabriele Franchere (between
> 1811-1814), said that the pigs had multiplied like crazy, to the
> degree where they were causing much damage to the roads. He had a
> great interest in food -- describing turnips and potatoes, wild
> berries and roots, fish of all kinds, pine moss, sea turtles,
> penguins (apparently not very tasty), even the type of tea and wine
> they were given aboard ship. However, he made no mention of seals,
> until he related an incident in which some poor seal hunters were
> stranded on an island by an unscrupulous ship captain. Which
> circumstance makes me entertain the idea that "Siwash Cosho"
> entered the Chinook Jargon with the first telling of that very
> tale. So perhaps the language of the fellow who was stranded, who
> was not chinook, has some bearing there. But we'll never know for
> sure.
>
> 3) Alexander Ross, in 1811, said he amused himself shooting seals
> at the falls on the Columbia. That sounds very high upriver.
>
>
> Oops, gotta go. Deadline!
>
>
> -- Leanne (http://timetemple.com)
>
>
> On Tuesday, September 14, 2004, at 09:18 , Scott Tyler wrote:
>
> > Hi Maria and All,
> > ? baaqii dakhaa tliik maliiya ?  tluLuu atls.
> > The Makah word for pig is  kwishoo  which is likely derived from
> > Chinook
> > kosho which is from French.
> > It is interesting that  k'ash-ch'u is similar sounding to Chinook word
> > kosho, but I think the similarity is purely accidental (or ?
> > incidental ?).
> > The last seal meat I had was many years ago at Neah Bay at 'old
> > man' Harry
> > Bowechop's house.  It had the texture of beef,
> > was very dark in color almost black (likely from the high
> > concentration of
> > myoglobin---which helps the seal store oxygen in muscle tissue for long
> > underwater dives),
> > and it was fishy tasting.  More like 'fishy beef' than pork. Seal
> > meat and
> > seal oil were common foods for Natives like 'bacon and eggs' for the
> > Americans, French and British.
> > I can understand them coining the term Indian pork [saywash cosho]  for
> > seal.
> > Scott
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Maria Pascua" <mcrcmaria at CENTURYTEL.NET>
> > To: <CHINOOK at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG>
> > Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 4:08 PM
> > Subject: Re: siwash cosho for "seal"
> >
> >
> >> In Makah, we have several words for seal/sea lions depending on
> >> the type
> >> seal; our word for what we call a hair seal or harbor seal is
> >> k'ash-ch'u
> >> or also pronounced k'ash-ch'u-oo.
> >> Maria
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: The Chinook List
> >> [mailto:CHINOOK at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG]On Behalf
> >> Of David Robertson
> >> Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2004 8:26 PM
> >> To: CHINOOK at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
> >> Subject: Re: siwash cosho for "seal"
> >>
> >> LhaXayam,
> >>
> >> "Siwash cosho" (sawash kushu) seems to me like it means "native
> >> pig", so I
> >> share your understanding of what "siwash" means.  Supposedly seal
> >> meat is
> >> like pork.
> >>
> >> There's a different word that was used in Chinuk-Wawa farther
> >> south, which
> >> comes from the Old Chinook language: "olehiyu" (ulXayu') also
> >> meaning "seal".
> >>
> >> Klahawiam naika,
> >>
> >> --Dave R
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sun, 5 Sep 2004 20:15:45 -0700, STEPHANIE FOGEL
> >> <kalapuyakwealth at MSN.COM> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I was interested in the origin of your definition for
> >>> "siwash"...using it
> >> to describe a seal, would that be "native seal?" ...because from
> >> what I've
> >> been taught "siwash" was used to describe "native peoples" or of
> >> native
> >> origin...just interested in what you would use this word for? Or
> >> how it
> >> pertains to "seal"...
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>>
> >>> Stephani
> >>
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> >>
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> >>
> >
> > To respond to the CHINOOK list, click 'REPLY ALL'.  To respond
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> >
> >
>
> To respond to the CHINOOK list, click 'REPLY ALL'.  To respond privately
to the sender of a message, click 'REPLY'.  Hayu masi!
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