[gothic-l] Re: The Scandinavian Origin of the Goths and Other Germanic Peoples

[dirk at SMRA.CO.UK]

The difference is that Anthony Appleyard's statement could imply (or 
leaves open) the possibility of (Indo/Proto etc-) Germanic settlement 
of Scandinavia (possibly from the Russian steppe via Karelia and 
Finland) at a much earlier time. This allows for the possibility of
an 
emergence of  'the Germanic culture' in Scandinavia from where they 
would have expanded to the continent. 

My statement precludes such a scenario and  supports theories which 
state that Germanic people expanded to Scandinavia at a much later 
date (say between 1000-700BC)from what is now central Germany. There 
seems to be overwhelming archaelogical, linguistic, and apparently 
also genetic evidence to support this view. 

PS: It took me some time to answer to Anthony Appelyard's statement, 
so you may not have been aware of the preceding exchange.

Dirk


--- In gothic-l at egroups.com, Bertil Häggman <mvk575b at t...> wrote:
> Dirk,
> 
> Really cannot see any difference between the two statements.
> 
> Gothically
> 
> Bertil
> 
> > Thinking and reading about your statement below, I find that it
is 
not 
> > very likely that 
> > 
> > "a branch of the speakers of the Common Indo-European 
> > language, 
> > > spreading gradually from their original home on the steppes of 
south 
> > Russia, 
> > > invaded the south of Scandinavia and became its ruling class, 
very 
> > many 
> > > centuries BC"
> > 
> > I read a few papers and I think that the currently accepted
wisdom 
is 
> > that Proto-Germanic people came to Scandinavia via the Jutland 
route 
> > about 700 BC, until than a Finnic/Baltic culture with a 
Finnic/Baltic 
> > language occupied the Scandinavian peninsula proper. These people 
were 
> > gradually driven to the far north and east by the Germanic 
settlers. 
> > Over the next centuries these settlers developed into various 
tribes 
> > probably including the Goths, who than around 100 BC left 
Scandinavia 
> > to settle at the mounth of the Vistula.
> > 
> > Dirk
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In gothic-l at egroups.com, "Anthony Appleyard" <MCLSSAA2 at f...> 
> > wrote:
> > > From: dirk at s... wrote:-
> > > > ... but it is more likely that proto-Germans moved to 
> > > > Scandinavia (before Gothic and other tribal identities were 
> > formed). ...
> > > 
> > > Or the speakers of the ancestor of the Common Germanic language 
did 
> > so. 
> > > Likeliest, a branch of the speakers of the Common Indo-European 
> > language, 
> > > spreading gradually from their original home on the steppes of 
south 
> > Russia, 
> > > invaded the south of Scandinavia and became its ruling class, 
very 
> > many 
> > > centuries BC. Over a few centuries they imposed their language 
and 
> > suppressed 
> > > whatever language the natives spoke before.
> > > 
> > > Those natives would themselves have had to come in from
outside, 
a 
> > long time 
> > > before that, when or after the first Homo sapiens came to the 
area. 
> > The 
> > > characteristic features of Nordic peoples would have evolved in 
the 
> > area:-
> > >   I saw an experiment on TV once that showed that blue eyes see 
> > better in 
> > > faint light and brown eyes see better in glare.
> > >   People need Vitamin D to avoid rickets. The body can make its 
own, 
> > but one 
> > > stage needs ultraviolet light. Thus the skin had to evolve as 
pale 
> > as possible 
> > > to let enough sun through it despite clouds and clothes and
dull 
> > weather.
> > > In hotter sunnier lands further south, such things did not keep 
the 
> > sun off 
> > > the skin so much.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > You are a member of the Gothic-L list.  To unsubscribe, send a 
blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe at egroups.com>.
> > Homepage: http://www.stormloader.com/carver/gothicl/index.html
> > 
> >


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