[gothic-l] Re: Gothic influence on Baltic Prussians

[dirk at SMRA.CO.UK]

--- In gothic-l at y..., "Håkan" <hakan36 at s...> wrote:
> --- In gothic-l at y..., dirk at s... wrote:
> > 
> > We had a short discussion about a possible Gothic influence on the 
> > later Prussians (Prussen, a Baltic people) before. However, I have 
> now 
> > received some Russian material about the recently rediscovered 
> Prussia 
> > Collection in Kaliningrad/Koenigsberg, which contained among 
others 
> > early Prussian and Gothic artefacts and the text suggests a 
certain 
> > continuity between the Vistula Gothic Willenberg/Wielbark culture, 
> the 
> > so called Masovia- Germanic culture of the 6th/7th century and the 
> > early Prussian culture. Interestingly, Wolfram suggests in his 
book 
> > 'The Goths', that parts of the Baltic Galindi joined the Goths, 
> which 
> > is also attested by Gothic personal names like Galindai. 
> > 
> > The Galindi were a Prussian subtribe like the Samen (not to be 
> > confused with the Scandinavian Saami) and Kuren. The Galindi 
> settled 
> > in the Masovia (Masuren) region were also Willenberg/Wilbark is 
> > situated and which may provide the link between the Gothic and the 
> > Prussian culture. From the 12th century the Prussians were 
absorbed 
> > into a population of German settlers, but the name Galinden 
> remained 
> > in use until the 18th century.
> > 
> > cheers
> > Dirk
> > 
> > For the Masovia-Germanic culture see:
> > V. I. Kulakov, "Mogil'niki zapadnoi chasti Mazurskogo poozer'ia 
> > konca  V-nachala VIII vv. " _Barbaricum_ 1 (1989),148-276; 
> >                   
> >             -- "Gräber pruzzischer Stammesführer aus Warnikam," 
> > Eurasia Antiqua_ 3 (1990), 595-628].
> 
> Hi Dirk!
> I just remember that I had a discussion with a guy on dejanews.com
> (not sure if that´s the adress now). He mentioned the jatvingians 
and 
> also that he thought that vandals came from the baltic verb vendit, 
> which meant "watch, guard". He also had a theory that the goths were 
> followed by baltic people. It´s possible that he had read Wolfram. 
> Hi´s and yours ideas seams very similar.  
> 
> 
> 
> Håkan Liljeberg

Hi Haakan,

thanks for the information. I guess that would be a question for 
linguists. According to Pohl (Die Germanen) many linguists seem 
to regard Baltic as close or closest relative to Germanic so, at least 
a common root of the Baltic word 'vendit' and the Vandal name cannot 
be ruled out.

 Some contact and influence of Gutones (the forefathers of the Goths) 
and Baltic people seems likely and the indication about the Prussian 
Galindi, offered by Wolfram seem to support the possibility of a 
cultural influence from the Gutones/Goths via the Masovia-Germanic 
culture of the 6th-8th century to the Baltic Prussians. It would 
perhaps be interesting to see whether the old-Prussian language which 
died out in the 17th century (religious texts were still translated 
into this language in the 16th century) contains east Germanic 
borrowings (or perhaps vice versa).

cheers
Dirk
 



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