[gothic-l] Re: EE Jews descend from Goths

[dirk at SMRA.CO.UK]

--- In gothic-l at y..., keth at o... wrote:
> I am sorry, Labovsky, but I feel these ideas are based upon
> a lack of familiarity with Yiddish and German, and it would surprise
> me if such an idea was actually found in Koestler's book.
> 
> The reason for my scepticism is that to me Yiddish appears
> as much too closely related to normal German, for it to be
> possible that it be in any way closer to Gothic than normal German
> is. I also believe Yiddish is a language that only arose in
> the late Middle Ages. That is, it descends from Middle High German,
> and not from Old High German.
> 
> These ideas I find confirmed in the little handy reference book,
> that I can recommend to those interested in a brief survey of the 
Germanic
> languages, written by Astrid Stedje and published by the Wilhelm 
Fink
> Verlag in Munich (Uni - Taschenbücher 1499). (it is in the 
"Taschenbuch"
> series and is hence not very expensive, but gives a handy overview 
of
> the different Germanic languages and their interrelationship).
> 
> Here is a sample of Yiddish taken from Astrid Stedjes book (page 
106):
> 
>              YIDISHER VISNSHAFTLEKHER INSTITUT
> 
>               Max Weinreich, Geschikhte fun der
> 
>                      yidisher sprakh.
> 
>                       (New York 1973)
> 
> Here another example:
> 
>   Schpaj nischt in brunem - efscher wesstu darfn fun im trinken 
wasser.
> 
> For me, who merely knows normal German, that is not difficult at
> all. It is definitely not Gothic.
> 

> Keth



Hello Keth,

I basically agree to all you said above, but your example of 
Yiddish caught me out. As a German native speaker I am at a loss to 
determine what the above sentence means. Something about a well 
(Brunnen - brunem) and drinking (trinken) of water (wasser), but 
for the words: Schpaj, efscher, wessto, darfn, fun, I cannot find a 
German equivalent and cannot get the meaning of that sentence. Can you 
solve the riddle for me?

cheers
Dirk
















> 
> 
> 
> > Some Ostrogoths who lived in what is now Ukraine in the 3rd and 
4th
> >centuries intermixed with Sarmats who were Iranians and the 
offspring
> >became what is now East European Jews. These offspring spoke the
> >dominant German(Yiddish) language and looked like the East European
> >Jews of today. In the Middle Ages these "Mulatoes" were convinced 
by
> >the visiting Jewish rabbis that they(Mulatoes) were really Jews 
from
> >Germany. The itinerant rabbis did the same trick with Khazars by
> >convincing Khazars to convert to Judaism. These "Mulatoes" were 
quite
> >unsophisticated and they believed the rabbis and became ardent 
Jews.
> >So there you go.
> >


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