[gothic-l] Re: Goths, Eruli in the East

[Oskar Andersson]

Hi,

although not adressed to me personally...

*snip*

> > Once again, East Scandinavians have nothing to do with East 
> Germanic 
> > people.
> 
>   Hæ Dirk.  Would you then call the Heruli going to Scandinavia; 
> North Germanic people?? If so, then the Ostrogoths were North 
> Germanic people too??

Einar, what do you base such an opinion on? We lately had the discussion 
on this very list that we really can't establish an ethnogenesis of the Ostrogoths 
until just prior to the conquest of Italy under Theodoric in 488/89, and there's 
no way of connecting that one to Scandinavia! Go check the archive for more information! 
This very question is of crucial importance as many an author seems to be referring 
to Visi/Ostro prior to their real ethnogeneses.
Look especially for Andreas Schwarcz posts on POLITICAL ethnogenesis rather than 
a "biological one"!

> In my view the Heruli group going to Scandinavia must be classified 
> as East Germanic people just like the Ostrogoths are classified as 
> such.

There are no conclusive proofs of Heruls going to Scandinavia at all, just as Dirk 
has said all the time! I have not met many a famous Scandinavian historian 
dealing with the subject or presenting evidence for such a migration - meaning 
that if a migration actually took place it caused a grand shift in Scandinavian history that might reasonably 
be attributed tot he Heruls. There's no way of proving that Heruls moved to Scandinavia [Thule] 
and were eloquent enough to distribute a "new culture and religion." (Though there's still the 
possibility that some of them actually did migrate to Thule!)
I do, however, appreciate the theories put forth by Tore and Troels though, even if I do not 
entirely agree with them!

> The Heruli settled among East Scandinavian people. Anyway I think 
> that it is generally accepted by scholars that this Heruli migration 
> took place.I understand it so after reading the posts on Germ. and 
> Gothic-L.

Einar, would you please put forth the names of the scholars advancing this theory, except 
Tore and Troels? I am interested in studying their works for a more complete appreciation 
of th matter! Moreover, there seems to be no scholar specialised in the history of Heruls... or 
am I wrong? From where do you draw this inference from?

And they settled among East Scandinavian people.
> So when you say that East Germanic people has nothing to do with East 
> Scandinavian people then you must be expressing your privat opinion.
> Most scholars do not seem to agree with you.

Again Einar, which scholars exactly are you referring to? Furthermore, what says that if some 
Heruls actually moved to Thule that they did not settle on what we TODAY call West Scandinavian 
territory, like Eastern Norway? The Kattegatt region as a whole seems like a prosperous area on the whole 
during the Migratory period!

> > Dirk
> >  
> > 
> > PS  Why do you always have to dig up such old authors? Some 
> > significant short commings of Guthmundson's book were revealed on 
> the 
> > Germanic list some time ago.
> 
>  Einar*******
> 
>  ***  What shortcomings specifically are you talking about? 
> And have you read his book?
> 
> I would like to if not opposed by the owner of the list(because this 
> is maybe considered off-topic) to answer you in more detail tomorrow 
> and clarify a few things. I admit that my presentation of Barðis 
> ideas have been chaotic and not so good. That does not make his ideas 
> wrong.
> 
> Bless Einar.

Best,
Oskar


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