[gothic-l] Re: Castile and Visigothic Tradition

[faltin2001]

--- In gothic-l at y..., "Carlos Carvalho" <cdecarvalho at s...> wrote:
> Me again Dirk,
>
> I agree with you, although some people here say it is historically
from
> Wulfila,
> I think only epigraphic witnesses were preserved of the latter,
contrasting
> to the elaborated
> handscripting, parallel to other similar styles in "Goth-free"
european
> countries.
>
> In my view it is debatable that gothic language had vanished
completely.
> Besides onomastics, a rich field of its own, several words were
inherited
> bye modern Portuguese (and Castillian) vocabulary.
> They wouldn't exist if no one knew the language anymore.
> Difficult to explain, latin seemed overwhelmingly adopted.



Hi Carlos,

I think it is only natural that Latin/Romanic was overwhelmingly
adopted. It is said that already at the time of the end of the
kingdom of Toulouse (507AD) Gothic was a dying language among the
Visigoths. As I had pointed out earlier a contemporary source dated
to 520AD (Tabulatura Gentis) already calles the Visigoths of Spain
the 'Romanic speaking Goths'. Also, we must not foreget that the
Visigoths who arrived in those regions in the 5th century were a
mixed group, which had been joined by Roman provincials, run-away
serfs and so on. Aslo, this group constantly had to interact with an
overwhelmingly Latin/Romanic speaking environment. Latin/Romanic
simply was the lingua franca of this group.

cheers,
Dirk












>
> Sleep tight,
>
> Carlos Carvalho
> (Maia - Portugal)
>
> > Hi Carlos,
> >
> > thanks a lot for the link. I understand that the Visigothic
script is
> > really a Latin minuscle of Spain which preceeded the Carolingian
> > script. I don't think that it has any linguistic relationship with
> > the Gothic language. The name seemed to have been given to denote
the
> > era when it was used rather than an ethnic linguistic affiliation
> > with Visigothic or the Visigoths. This would also be natural,
since
> > the Gothic language was discontinued among the Visigoth at a very
> > early stage. In fact, the 'Tabulatura Gentes' of about 520AD calls
> > the Visigoths also Valagoths (i.e. the Romanic speaking Goths).
> >
> > cheers
> > Dirk
>
>
>
> > --- In gothic-l at y..., "Carlos Carvalho" <cdecarvalho at s...> wrote:
> > > Hi Dirk,
> > >
> > > By "pure" Visigothic I mean the writing that was not influenced
> > > by Carolina style, that followed. Most of these documents are in
> > Latin,
> > > however.
> > > It is indeed an old Hispanic (but also appears in France and
Italy).
> > > It is also said to be invented by Wulfila.
> > > It is quite different from the German script who carries a
similar
> > name and
> > > appears here and there. (if we are talking about the same font-
> > style)
> > >
> > > Please have a look at:
> > > http://medievalwriting.50megs.com/scripts/history4.htm
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Carlos Carvalho


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