[gothic-l] Re: Goths and Jutes

[faltin2001]

--- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "sunnytjatsingh" 
<sunnytjatsingh at y...> wrote:
> Hi Guys, please I would like your views on Goths and Jutes, and 
> possible Getae.  Any truth to these statements below:
> 
> According to the 1670 work De Anglorum Gentis Origine Disceptatio:
> 
> Those people are called Gutae in the laws of Edward the Confessor, 
> and Geatuni in the Annales Petroburgenses; by others they are 
called 
> Jotuni and Jetae; by the Danish writers, Jutae and Juitae; for 
these 
> are one and the same name: Getae and Giotae, and Gutae, and 
Geatuni, 
> and Jotuni, and Jetae, and Jutae, and Juitae (Kliger 1952: 17-18).



That is of course wrong again. As Francisc has explained at length, 
Getae have nothing to do with Germanic tribes like Goti or Jutae. 
Also the apparent similarity between Jutae and Gutae is a fallacy. 
The name Jutae is in its earliest forms rendered as Eucci, Euthiones, 
Eotas, etc. 







> 
> In his Origin of the Anglo-Saxon Race, Shore writes about the Jutes:
> 
> In early records relating to Germany and the North they appear to 
> have been called by many names – Vitungi or Juthungi, Jutae, 
Gaetas, 
> Gothi, Gothini, Gythones, Guthones, Gutae, Gautae, Vitae, and Gaeta 
> (Shore 1906: 49). 



You really should get yourself some more modern literature:-) The 
author mixes up all sorts of completely unrelated names. For example, 
the Juthungi were associated with the Semnones, as a 1990 discovery 
of the victory stela from Augsburg shows. The earlier assumption that 
they belonged to the Jutae is probably wrong. The stela suggests that 
Juthungi was a synonym for the Suebian Semnones. The Gythones is the 
name which Ptolemy seems to have given to the Gothones of Tacitus. 
The Gutae and GAutae and Gaeta are Scandinavian people, while the 
Gothi appear first in the 3rd century, but they are likely related to 
the Gythones and Gothones. In short, try to get access to a modern 
book on Germanic peoples. A lot has happened since 1670, 1906 and the 
ppresent time.





> 
> Shore continues, "Of these Jutes, the Goths were probably the more 
> numerous, seeing that the name adopted from the Kentish people 
> generally was a modified form of Gutae, a name for their own race 
> (Shore 1906: 191)."  


There is nothing, but a faint and coincidental name similarity to 
link Jutes with Goths (in fact I don't even see this similarity, so 
the whole sentence is nonsense.

If you read German, I good overview over most Germanic tribes is 
Bruno Krüger's two volumes 'Die Germanen', 1987, but any smaller 
English language work (M. Todd The Ancient Germans) will teach you 
more than those outdated books which you use.


Best
Dirk 



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