[gothic-l] Re; Yair

[sunnytjatsingh]

Hi Yair, 

""Yada" or "Yda" was an area east of the Caspian and to the north of 
Central 
Asia.  It was associated with the original Nephtali or Hephtali who 
later MAY HAVE 
given their name to another group as frequently occurred in this 
whole region. "Yda" could be another name for the Plain of "Ida" upon 
which.  Asgard was founded (according to Snorre) and to which the 
ancestral gods will return."

Are you talking about the Yetha (White Huns or Hephthalites)?  The 
Chinese writers clearly note that this group of "Huns" was not like 
the other Huns in appearance.  Procopius says they have "fair skin 
and regular features" suggesting that they looked different than the 
other Huns.  Other peculiarities of this tribes shows they certainly 
were not Huns proper.   

What about Asgard?

"The Nephtali in Chinese documents are referred to as the "Little 
Guti" as 
distinct from the "Great Guti" (Ta Yuehchi)."

May I ask which Chinese documents refer to the "Hephthali" as the 
Xiao or Little Yuezhi?
I have read that the Hephthalite's origin may lie from a group of 
Yuezhi that settled near the Great Wall.  

"The "Great Guti" are the Massagetae and the name "Massagetae" is 
also said 
to mean "Great Getae"."

I agree. 

"In this region (says Herodotus and others) were the Thysagetae whose 
name 
according to authorities quoted by Rawlinson also means
"Little Getae"."

Actually Rawlinson calls the Thyssagetae, "the Lesser Goths".  I am 
not 100% sure about Thyssa-Getae, I have heard Rawlinson's view, but 
there is also a view of "Western" Getae.  I have labored a great deal 
to find the origin of the root Thyssa, which I believe is Iranian, to 
little avail.  Perhaps it is similar to "Tissa", i.e. the Persian or 
Parthian (?) King Tissa-phernes?  Do you and anyone else know any 
information about this?  Thyssa or Tissa, in Iranian, or even Slavic, 
Latin or Greek?

 ""Getae" and "Guti" in these cases are synonymous."

Quite possible. 

"The founder of the Scythian nation (i.e. Royal Scythes and their 
kin) was 
Tyrgitaus whose name could also mean
"Tyr of the Geats" and this was later one of the numerous titles 
applied to 
Odin."

Never heard this one before.  Targitaus was one of the three son's in 
the legend of the origin of the Scythians.  I also do not recall Odin 
being deemed "Tyr of the Geats". Interesting – can you suggest any 
books on this info?

Alternately, I believe the River Tyre or Tyras mentioned in antiquity 
is the modern Dniester River.  Therefore, the groups of Getae called 
Tyrigetae may actually be the Dniester Getae.

"Snore says that Odin and his group came from the shores of the Black 
Sea 
and the Don River region but that they had kinfolk in the east.

Do you have the full reference for Snore?  I have read the view of a 
few Slavic writers that also claim the Don river area – not sure.  
Any suggestion of well-respected books on Odin, in general?  Kind of 
strange that Din in Panjabi and Hindi means "day"??  

"I mentioned also that some Roman sources identified the Massagetae 
with 
the Goths and also was requested to give sources."

Please. 

"Again I am going back through my notes but Wolfram in his History of 
the 
Goths discusses this point and the sources and so do others
and I think it has probably already been brought up from time to time 
on 
this list."

I read Wolfram a couple years ago, I can't recall if he specifically 
calls out the Massagetae.  Scythians and the Getae certainly.  

Your comments are most appreciated. 

Best Wishes, 



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