[gothic-l] Re: Christensen's book on the Goths

[faltin2001]

--- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "Ravi Chaudhary" 
<ravichaudhary2000 at y...> wrote:
> --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "faltin2001" <dirk at s...> wrote:
> > I have had a first quick read-through of the new book by Arne 
Soby 
> > Christensen „Cassiodorus Jordanes and the History of the Goths", 
> > Museum Tusculum Press, University of Copenhagen, 2002. 
> > another view:
> 
> 
>  Ravi: I posted the above on the Jathistory list, here is a 
response 
> I got:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JatHistory/message/598
> 
> Ravi
> 
> Sunny Singh writes:
> 
>  just a supplement - I have indeed studied 
> Christensen very carefully, and I caught the caveat, which 
> undoubtedly may be an important hole in this individual's theory. 
> 
> As a repeat, A.S. Christensen of the University of Copenhagen, 
argues 
> that the identification of the Goths with the Getae by the 
classical 
> writers is erroneous (Christensen 2002). However, Christensen still 
> comments on the following point made by Jakob Grimm:
> 
> J. Grimm was the last to defend an opposing view, based on the 
> argument that the Getae are mentioned during early Antiquity. They 
> later disappear completely, while the Goths appear in the sources 
at 
> approximately the same time. Was it conceivable that the Getae just 
> suddenly disappeared? His point is, of course, that a certain 
people 
> were initially referred to as Getae and later came to be called 
Goths 
> (Christensen 2002: 247). 
> 
> Is it not that that Grimm was on to something? Does this not imply 
> that Goth is a new name for the same people? Why is this point 
simply 
> smoothed over?




The Getae have nothing to do with the Goths. In reality even 
Cassiodorus/Jordanes were somewhat sceptical of this link, which 
caused them to include the 'sentence that names are often borrowed 
across peoples', when he realised that all the Getaec kings had non-
Germanic names. 







> 
> Another authority, this time a respectable linguistic scholar in 
his 
> own day, Bosworth, makes the same assertion as Grimm:
> 
> According to the opinion of many Scandinavian antiquaries, the 
Goths 
> who overran the Roman empire, came from Scandinavian or Sweden; but 
> Tacitus speaks of no Goths in Scandinavia, and only of Suiones, 
which 
> is the same name that the Swen-skar (Swedes) apply to themselves at 
> the present day. It is therefore more probable, as some learned 
> Swedes acknowledge, that the when the Goths wandered towards the 
west 
> and south of Europe, some of them, in early times, crossed the 
Baltic 
> and established themselves in the south of Sweden and the island of 
> Gothland. We know from Tacitus, just cited, that the Goths that the 
> Goths were in Pomeralia and Prussia, near the Vistula, about A.D. 
80
 
> (Bosworth 1848: 113-114).
> 
> Is it not fitting to examine this view? Best Wishes, 
> 
> Bosworth, J. The Origin of the English, Germanic and Scandinavian 
> Languages, and Nations. London. Longman, Brown, Green, and 
Longsman: 
> 1848.




Bosworth's mid-19th century assertation is laudible as it shows a lot 
of foresight. Yet, we don't really know if the Gotones mentioned by 
Tacitus are really the forefathers of the later Gothi either. They 
may well be related though, but that is by no means certain. 






> 
> Christensen, A.S. Cassidorus Jordanses and the History of the Goths 
> Studies in a Migration Myth. Copenhagen. Museum Tusculanum Press: 
> 2002. 
> 
> PS - Please see Wolfram's book on Goths, for a more balanced view 
and 
> a more honest approach.



Wolfram's book on the Goths is certainly worth reading, but it is 
neither more honest nor more balanced, since Christensen is not 
dishonest or unbalanced. 

Dirk 


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