[gothic-l] Re: Neologisms Dictionary + new site on Crimean Gothic
llama_nom
600cell at OE.ECLIPSE.CO.UK
Sun Jan 23 14:58:35 UTC 2005
i could repost the old
> neologisms i gathered from the first few hundred posts of this
list if
> you're interested...
Yes, that would be good. I really like the alliterative Ring Verse,
by the way! That was one of the first things I found years ago when
I first looked for Gothic on the internet.
Anyone combing my dictionary for neologisms should search for the
symbol ! (this will turn up imperatives too, but should also locate
the 23 or so outright neologisms in there).
http://www.oe.eclipse.co.uk/nom/egdhome.html
There's also notes in the Introduction about making feminine agent
nouns from the various classes of masculines, and vice versa. And a
few more in the Þeihsafarande faurawaurd "preface for time-
travellers".
As I think someone mentioned on an early post here, there are many
neologisms/reconstructions in Jakob Grimm's Teutonic Mythology.
I don't know what conclusions other have reached, but I used to
render "yesterday" as *fauradagis, but considering Go. fairnin
jera "last year"--I'm inclining more towards * fairnin
daga "yesterday" (reserving *fauradagis for "on the previous day").
Some suggestions for grammar words I thought of a while back; assume
asterisks everywhere except gumakunds "male", qinakunds "female",
samaqiss "agreement":
waihtiwaurd - noun
tojawaurd - verb
hvileikawaurd - adjective
hvewaurd - adverb
faurwaurd - pronoun
frehawaurd - interrogative
raþjawaurd - numeral
particle - daili (or attested: drauhsna, gabruka, daila "piece of
money, fellowship")
gumakunds - masculine
qinakunds - feminine
nihvaþarakunds - neuter (half-calque on Latin)
namnadrusts (nd.) - nominative
þuladrusts (þd.) - accusative
aiginadrusts (ad.) - genitive
gibadrusts (gd.) - dative
hvedrusts (hvd.) - intrumental
afdrusts, ibdrusts?, halþs - oblique
(Those owe a lot to Icelandic, except that they're nouns, but I
picked *gibadrusts, rather than *nimadrusts for the sake of
abbreviations, to avoid confusion over initials. Maybe the
adjective of nominative could be a past participle *namnadrusans.)
numel - present tense
faurmel - past tense, preterite (cf. faur mel "before time, in
advance"; faur "ago, past"; or like Icelandic *þanmel, but this
would make it harder to translate Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's Rainbow
into Gothic...)
anawairþamel - future tense
spillamodei - indicative mood
untriggwamodei - subjunctive
= wiljamodei - optative
tojastibna - active voice
þulastibna - passive voice
samaqiss - agreement
relative particle - kunjando daili
compund word - gagahaftiþ waurd
conjunction - bindawaurd
bihliuþs - umlaut
afhliuþs - ablaut
afhliudatewa - ablaut series
Incidentally, has anyone noticed whether Gothic has any tendency to
agree more with North or West Germanic in words of doubtful gender?
All the examples I can think of are unclear in Gothic, due to lack
of attested forms: dal(s), biuþ(s), lubi/lubja.
Llama Nom
PS. here's something I discovered last night:
http://www.dike.de/pfr-tischner/22-spr/ht-germ/krimgot.htm
A "complete etymological dictionary of Crimean Gothic", with
speculations on pronunciation.
--- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "thiudans" <thiudans at y...> wrote:
>
>
> My domain matthewcarver.com is in limbo right now... the old credit
> card it was drawing from expired and they were sending notices to a
> defunct email address. i'm waiting for another month i think.
anyway i
> still have the files on my storage disk. funny, i had forgotten
about
> stormloader until a few months ago. don't think i remember the
> password or username for changing the files. :) i could repost the
old
> neologisms i gathered from the first few hundred posts of this
list if
> you're interested...
>
> -Matthew
>
>
> > Some other sources for neologisms:
> >
> > http://www.angelfire.com/goth/kuni/
> > http://members.aol.com/yahyam/BagmeBloma.html
> > http://www.stormloader.com/carver/gutrazda/
> > http://matthewcarver.com/gutrazda/
> >
> > The last is Matthew's newer site, but unfortunately it doesn't
seem
> > to be working these days. It had some fun stuff composed by
members
> > of this list, long before I joined. His old site also has
Tolkien's
> > Bagme Bloma. (Re which: wagjand lindos seems more like it ought
to
> > be "they shake lindens/shields?" than "...gently". And
fraujinon
> > takes dative, so: fraujinondei fairgunja -- which wrecks the
rhyme
> > scheme, I know...) There is a newer corrected version of Tim
> > O'Neil's Wulfila Poem here:
> >
> > http://www.ancientsites.com/aw/Post/226178
> >
> > Llama Nom
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts at h...>
wrote:
> > >
> > > Thanx...
> > >
> > > That seems to be a quite good idea, to collect neologisms from
> > > different persons...
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "llama_nom" <600cell at o...>
wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Excellent stuff, Fredrik!
> > > >
> > > > I just looked at the dictionary. When I have time I'll
extract
> > the
> > > > approximately 20 neologisms from my English-Gothic
dictionary
> > for
> > > > you. If this is okay with Francisc, it would be good to
include
> > > his
> > > > creations and make a really big combined effort. >
> > > > Llama Nom
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts at h...>
> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Llama Nom
> > > > >
> > > > > I totaly agree with anuþs instead of anuds. And with d in
> > plural
> > > > and
> > > > > some cases in singular. The similarity with 'anus' that
some
> > > > > mentioned ain't that shocking. If I remember right that
word
> > > > > means 'ring', and what is shocking about that, (except the
> > > obvious
> > > > > reason)?
> > > > >
> > > > > I read the post 1223 and found that very interesting. A
lot of
> > > > those
> > > > > words are similar to neologisms I "made" myself.
> > > > > Such words as potato and strawberry are the same as I
thought
> > of.
> > > > > I don't think I've seen any word for nut anywhere som
guess it
> > > > would
> > > > > be like hnutus or something like that, (don't know which
> > gender).
> > > > To
> > > > > continue the same way of making the words of potato and
> > stawberry
> > > > > with the word aírþa- as first part, I'd like to add the
word
> > > > > aírþahnutus as peanut. (swedish: jordnöt = peanut).
> > > > >
> > > > > About the word for president 1223 had faursitands, and i
> > thought
> > > > of
> > > > > faurasitands. Is faur better than faura in this case?
> > > > >
> > > > > I have a list of neologisms (and some, maybe 5 non
neologisms)
> > if
> > > > > some one is interested. I guess some are not that well
done,
> > cos
> > > I
> > > > > made em when I wasn't that good at this. But I hope you
can
> > tell
> > > > me
> > > > > corrections.
> > > > > It's on a website that is:
> > > > > http://www.geocities.com/gutiska/lex/neologism.html
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > /Fredrik
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "llama_nom"
<600cell at o...>
> > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Oscar,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ni ibnaleik ak galeik! ("Not equal, but similar", to
> > paraphrase
> > > > the
> > > > > > Skeireins...) Ahaks "pigeon". Anaks "suddenly". But
> > alright
> > > > for
> > > > > > alliteration, oh dear:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Nu skulum namnjan
> > > > > > namna fugle,
> > > > > > anuþ jah ahak,
> > > > > > all þatei fliugiþ,
> > > > > > hrabn hrukjandan,
> > > > > > hraiwadubon,
> > > > > > aran swaswe agatja,
> > > > > > airþabundanana hanan.
> > > > > > Gauros gansuns
> > > > > > goljand sik uhtwon.
> > > > > > Falka sa frija
> > > > > > ufar fulþon galaiþ,
> > > > > > unafswaggwiþs
> > > > > > sweþauh waijiþ.
> > > > > > Sparwan, sparwari
> > > > > > bi spedistin qiþa.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Fredrik,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Looks good to me. I'd wondered about this word ages
ago,
> > > before
> > > > I
> > > > > > had access to all these great dictionaries on the
internet.
> > I
> > > > > can't
> > > > > > remember what conclusion I reached, if any, but I didn't
> > know
> > > > about
> > > > > > the Lithuanian cognate then--which I think is what
suggests
> > an
> > > i-
> > > > > > stem. Makes a nice addition to our Gothic vocabulary!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The normal practice is to change -d to -þ at the end of
a
> > word
> > > > or
> > > > > > before -s, but sometimes the -d was written as such.
E.g.
> > gods
> > > > &
> > > > > > goþs both occur, and by chance the former is actually
more
> > > > common.
> > > > > > Apparently such spellings are most often found in
certain
> > > > specific
> > > > > > sections of the Bible, e.g. Luke's gospel.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Oh and on the subject of reconstructing vocabulary, you
> > might
> > > be
> > > > > > interested in Post 1223, a very early message from
Francisc
> > > > which I
> > > > > > came across recently. Especially the ingenious lists of
> > > > chemical
> > > > > > and geographical terms.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The Cleasby & Vigfusson Icelandic-English Dictionary has
> > some
> > > > > > interesting comments on Gothic, including at least one
> > probable
> > > > > loan-
> > > > > > word into Old Spanish, not listed in Koebler:
> > *brano "heifer"
> > > > > (young
> > > > > > female cow) = OIc. brana.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > And finally, Francisc,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Good work on the Crossword! I've added your guesses. I
> > hope
> > > it
> > > > > > isn't making anyone too cross yet...
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Llama Nom
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, OSCAR HERRERA
> > <duke.co at s...>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > waila,so waurd anaks(pigeons) samaleika ist...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Fredrik <gadrauhts at h...> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hi all!
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I don't do much so i think about words in gothic which
i
> > > > cannot
> > > > > > find
> > > > > > > in any dicctionary. Now it's the gothic word for duck.
I
> > have
> > > > > > > searched for it in all dicctionaries I know about on
> > internet
> > > > but
> > > > > > > without finding any so i took the freedom to recreate
it
> > > > instead.
> > > > > > > I wonder if you think this is ok or if not.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The word in swedish is 'and' (or in another
form 'anka')
> > and
> > > > the
> > > > > > > german is 'ente'. Acording to some books and
dicctionaries
> > > > (like
> > > > > > > runeberg.org) this comes from *anuðiz.
> > > > > > > I guess this would have been 'anuds' in gothic, and an
i-
> > stem.
> > > > > > > The icelandic önd and the german ente is both feminine
so
> > > > > > therefore
> > > > > > > I guess the gothic word also is feminine.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Comments please!
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > /Fredrik
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe,
> > send a
> > > > > > blank email to .
> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
In low income neighborhoods, 84% do not own computers.
At Network for Good, help bridge the Digital Divide!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/S.QlOD/3MnJAA/Zx0JAA/wWMplB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe at egroups.com>.
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gothic-l/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
gothic-l-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
More information about the Gothic-l
mailing list