[gothic-l] Re: Neologisms Dictionary + new site on Crimean Gothic

Fredrik gadrauhts at HOTMAIL.COM
Mon Jan 24 15:00:54 UTC 2005


Llama Nom

Nice done...I just thought of this myself some days ago, and now I 
wont need to think of this anymore :)
But I miss two words, one for 'gender' and one for 'case'.
I assume gender would be 'kunds' and case 'drusts', considering what 
your words contain.
> 
> Some suggestions for grammar words I thought of a while back; 
assume 
> asterisks everywhere except gumakunds "male", qinakunds "female", 
> samaqiss "agreement":
> 
> waihtiwaurd - noun
> tojawaurd - verb
> hvileikawaurd - adjective
> hvewaurd - adverb
> faurwaurd - pronoun
> frehawaurd - interrogative
> raþjawaurd - numeral
> particle - daili (or attested: drauhsna, gabruka, daila "piece of 
> money, fellowship")
> 
> gumakunds - masculine
> qinakunds - feminine
> nihvaþarakunds - neuter (half-calque on Latin)
> 
> namnadrusts (nd.) - nominative
> þuladrusts (þd.) - accusative
> aiginadrusts (ad.) - genitive
> gibadrusts (gd.) - dative
> hvedrusts (hvd.) - intrumental
> 
> afdrusts, ibdrusts?, halþs - oblique
> 
> (Those owe a lot to Icelandic, except that they're nouns, but I 
> picked *gibadrusts, rather than *nimadrusts for the sake of 
> abbreviations, to avoid confusion over initials.  Maybe the 
> adjective of nominative could be a past participle *namnadrusans.)
> 
> numel - present tense
> faurmel - past tense, preterite (cf. faur mel "before time, in 
> advance"; faur "ago, past"; or like Icelandic *þanmel, but this 
> would make it harder to translate Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's 
Rainbow 
> into Gothic...)
> anawairþamel - future tense
> 
> spillamodei - indicative mood
> untriggwamodei - subjunctive
> = wiljamodei - optative
> tojastibna - active voice
> þulastibna - passive voice
> 
> samaqiss - agreement
> 
> relative particle - kunjando daili
> compund word - gagahaftiþ waurd
> conjunction - bindawaurd
> 
> bihliuþs - umlaut
> afhliuþs - ablaut
> afhliudatewa - ablaut series
> 
> Incidentally, has anyone noticed whether Gothic has any tendency to 
> agree more with North or West Germanic in words of doubtful 
gender?  
> All the examples I can think of are unclear in Gothic, due to lack 
> of attested forms: dal(s), biuþ(s), lubi/lubja.
> 
> Llama Nom
> 
> 
> PS. here's something I discovered last night:
> 
> http://www.dike.de/pfr-tischner/22-spr/ht-germ/krimgot.htm
> 
> A "complete etymological dictionary of Crimean Gothic", with 
> speculations on pronunciation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "thiudans" <thiudans at y...> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > My domain matthewcarver.com is in limbo right now... the old 
credit
> > card it was drawing from expired and they were sending notices to 
a
> > defunct email address. i'm waiting for another month i think. 
> anyway i
> > still have the files on my storage disk. funny, i had forgotten 
> about
> > stormloader until a few months ago. don't think i remember the
> > password or username for changing the files. :) i could repost 
the 
> old
> > neologisms i gathered from the first few hundred posts of this 
> list if
> > you're interested...
> > 
> > -Matthew
> > 
> > 
> > > Some other sources for neologisms:
> > > 
> > > http://www.angelfire.com/goth/kuni/
> > > http://members.aol.com/yahyam/BagmeBloma.html
> > > http://www.stormloader.com/carver/gutrazda/
> > > http://matthewcarver.com/gutrazda/
> > > 
> > > The last is Matthew's newer site, but unfortunately it doesn't 
> seem 
> > > to be working these days.  It had some fun stuff composed by 
> members 
> > > of this list, long before I joined.  His old site also has 
> Tolkien's 
> > > Bagme Bloma.  (Re which: wagjand lindos seems more like it 
ought 
> to 
> > > be "they shake lindens/shields?" than "...gently".  And 
> fraujinon 
> > > takes dative, so: fraujinondei fairgunja -- which wrecks the 
> rhyme 
> > > scheme, I know...)  There is a newer corrected version of Tim 
> > > O'Neil's Wulfila Poem here:
> > > 
> > > http://www.ancientsites.com/aw/Post/226178
> > > 
> > > Llama Nom
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts at h...> 
> wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > Thanx...
> > > > 
> > > > That seems to be a quite good idea, to collect neologisms 
from 
> > > > different persons...
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "llama_nom" <600cell at o...> 
> wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > Excellent stuff, Fredrik!
> > > > > 
> > > > > I just looked at the dictionary.  When I have time I'll 
> extract 
> > > the 
> > > > > approximately 20 neologisms from my English-Gothic 
> dictionary 
> > > for 
> > > > > you.  If this is okay with Francisc, it would be good to 
> include 
> > > > his 
> > > > > creations and make a really big combined effort.  > 
> > > > > Llama Nom
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts at h...> 
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Llama Nom
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I totaly agree with anuþs instead of anuds. And with d in 
> > > plural 
> > > > > and 
> > > > > > some cases in singular. The similarity with 'anus' that 
> some 
> > > > > > mentioned ain't that shocking. If I remember right that 
> word 
> > > > > > means 'ring', and what is shocking about that, (except 
the 
> > > > obvious 
> > > > > > reason)?
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I read the post 1223 and found that very interesting. A 
> lot of 
> > > > > those 
> > > > > > words are similar to neologisms I "made" myself.
> > > > > > Such words as potato and strawberry are the same as I 
> thought 
> > > of.
> > > > > > I don't think I've seen any word for nut anywhere som 
> guess it 
> > > > > would 
> > > > > > be like hnutus or something like that, (don't know which 
> > > gender). 
> > > > > To 
> > > > > > continue the same way of making the words of potato and 
> > > stawberry 
> > > > > > with the word aírþa- as first part, I'd like to add the 
> word 
> > > > > > aírþahnutus as peanut. (swedish: jordnöt = peanut).
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > About the word for president 1223 had faursitands, and i 
> > > thought 
> > > > > of 
> > > > > > faurasitands. Is faur better than faura in this case?
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I have a list of neologisms (and some, maybe 5 non 
> neologisms) 
> > > if 
> > > > > > some one is interested. I guess some are not that well 
> done, 
> > > cos 
> > > > I 
> > > > > > made em when I wasn't that good at this. But I hope you 
> can 
> > > tell 
> > > > > me 
> > > > > > corrections.
> > > > > > It's on a website that is:
> > > > > > http://www.geocities.com/gutiska/lex/neologism.html
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > /Fredrik
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "llama_nom" 
> <600cell at o...> 
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Oscar,
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Ni ibnaleik ak galeik! ("Not equal, but similar", to 
> > > paraphrase 
> > > > > the 
> > > > > > > Skeireins...)  Ahaks "pigeon".  Anaks "suddenly".  But 
> > > alright 
> > > > > for 
> > > > > > > alliteration, oh dear:
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Nu skulum namnjan
> > > > > > > namna fugle,
> > > > > > > anuþ jah ahak,
> > > > > > > all þatei fliugiþ,
> > > > > > > hrabn hrukjandan,
> > > > > > > hraiwadubon,
> > > > > > > aran swaswe agatja,
> > > > > > > airþabundanana hanan.
> > > > > > > Gauros gansuns
> > > > > > > goljand sik uhtwon.
> > > > > > > Falka sa frija
> > > > > > > ufar fulþon galaiþ,
> > > > > > > unafswaggwiþs
> > > > > > > sweþauh waijiþ.
> > > > > > > Sparwan, sparwari
> > > > > > > bi spedistin qiþa.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Fredrik,
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Looks good to me.  I'd wondered about this word ages 
> ago, 
> > > > before 
> > > > > I 
> > > > > > > had access to all these great dictionaries on the 
> internet.  
> > > I 
> > > > > > can't 
> > > > > > > remember what conclusion I reached, if any, but I 
didn't 
> > > know 
> > > > > about 
> > > > > > > the Lithuanian cognate then--which I think is what 
> suggests 
> > > an 
> > > > i-
> > > > > > > stem.  Makes a nice addition to our Gothic vocabulary!
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > The normal practice is to change -d to -þ at the end of 
> a 
> > > word 
> > > > > or 
> > > > > > > before -s, but sometimes the -d was written as such.  
> E.g. 
> > > gods 
> > > > > & 
> > > > > > > goþs both occur, and by chance the former is actually 
> more 
> > > > > common.  
> > > > > > > Apparently such spellings are most often found in 
> certain 
> > > > > specific 
> > > > > > > sections of the Bible, e.g. Luke's gospel.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Oh and on the subject of reconstructing vocabulary, you 
> > > might 
> > > > be 
> > > > > > > interested in Post 1223, a very early message from 
> Francisc 
> > > > > which I 
> > > > > > > came across recently.  Especially the ingenious lists 
of 
> > > > > chemical 
> > > > > > > and geographical terms.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > The Cleasby & Vigfusson Icelandic-English Dictionary 
has 
> > > some 
> > > > > > > interesting comments on Gothic, including at least one 
> > > probable 
> > > > > > loan-
> > > > > > > word into Old Spanish, not listed in Koebler: 
> > > *brano "heifer" 
> > > > > > (young 
> > > > > > > female cow) = OIc. brana.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > And finally, Francisc,
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Good work on the Crossword!  I've added your guesses.  
I 
> > > hope 
> > > > it 
> > > > > > > isn't making anyone too cross yet...
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Llama Nom
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > --- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, OSCAR HERRERA 
> > > <duke.co at s...> 
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > waila,so waurd anaks(pigeons) samaleika ist...
> > > > > > > >  
> > > > > > > >  
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > Fredrik <gadrauhts at h...> wrote:
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > Hi all!
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > I don't do much so i think about words in gothic 
which 
> i 
> > > > > cannot 
> > > > > > > find 
> > > > > > > > in any dicctionary. Now it's the gothic word for 
duck. 
> I 
> > > have 
> > > > > > > > searched for it in all dicctionaries I know about on 
> > > internet 
> > > > > but 
> > > > > > > > without finding any so i took the freedom to recreate 
> it 
> > > > > instead.
> > > > > > > > I wonder if you think this is ok or if not.
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > The word in swedish is 'and' (or in another 
> form 'anka') 
> > > and 
> > > > > the 
> > > > > > > > german is 'ente'. Acording to some books and 
> dicctionaries 
> > > > > (like 
> > > > > > > > runeberg.org) this comes from *anuðiz.
> > > > > > > > I guess this would have been 'anuds' in gothic, and 
an 
> i-
> > > stem.
> > > > > > > > The icelandic önd and the german ente is both 
feminine 
> so 
> > > > > > > therefore 
> > > > > > > > I guess the gothic word also is feminine.
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > Comments please!
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > /Fredrik
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To 
unsubscribe, 
> > > send a 
> > > > > > > blank email to . 
> > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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