Typology and the phonetics of laryngeals

[proto-language]

Dear Ante and IEists:

 ----- Original Message -----
From: "Ante Aikio" <anaikio at mail.student.oulu.fi>
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 5:50 AM

> On Sat, 25 Mar 2000, Herb Stahlke wrote:

>> In the various IE handbooks, I've seen a number of phonetic solutions
>> proposed for the problem of what the laryngeals were phonetically, but all
>> of them look like typologically odd sets of sounds given standard
>> reconstructions for PIE.

>> In the '70s and '80s, phonological typology was called on pretty heavily
>> to motivate the glottalic hypothesis for PIE.  I'm puzzled about the near
>> absence of application of typology to the question of what the phonetic
>> values of the laryngeals might have been.

>> Have I missed obvious sources?  Has there been discussion of the typology
>> of laryngeals?

> I am not familiar with the typological discussion (if there was any), but
> another thing that may be of interest in this context comes into my mind.
> I believe the IE loan words that show laryngeal reflexes in Uralic may
> tell something about the phonetic values of laryngeals. Since there are
> etymologies that show such substitutions as 1) *h[1-3] > Uralic *k, 2)
> *h[1-3] > Uralic *x (read *x as [Y] =gamma), 3) *h[1-2] > Uralic
> (retroflex) *S, it seems probable that some [x]-type sounds must be
> reconstructed (/x4 x xw/, perhaps?) Such phonetic values as e.g. [?] for
> *h1 proposed by e.g. Beekes 1995 seem problematic to me; a substitution
> [?] > [k] seems perfectly possible, but [?] > [Y] does not, let alone [?]
> > [S].

[PR]

I think a ready earliest pattern, the source of which will remain
respectfully nameless, would indicate:

/*h, *H (he:), *$ ('ain), *?/

although by slightly later times, what seems to me like a natural
development would be:

/*h, *x, *Y (gamma), *0/

which seems to correspond fairly well to the Uralic facts: perhaps:

/*h, *0/ -> *k(2); /*Y/ -> *x; /*x/ (if palatalized before *e) -> /*S/

Pat

PATRICK C. RYAN | PROTO-LANGUAGE at email.msn.com (501) 227-9947 * 9115 W. 34th
St. Little Rock, AR 72204-4441 USA WEBPAGES: PROTO-LANGUAGE:
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http://www.geocities.com/proto-language/proto-religion/indexR.html "Veit ek,
at ek hekk, vindga meipi, nftr allar nmu, geiri undapr . . . a ~eim meipi er
mangi veit hvers hann af rstum renn." (Havamal 138)