LL-L: "Language varieties" LOWLANDS-L, 01.OCT.2000 (02) [E/German]

[Lowlands-L]

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  L O W L A N D S - L * 01.OCT.2000 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
  Posting Address: <lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org>
  Web Site: <http://www.geocities.com/sassisch/rhahn/lowlands/>
  User's Manual: <http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html>
  Archive: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html>
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  A=Afrikaans, Ap=Appalachean, D=Dutch, E=English, F=Frisian, L=Limburgish
  LS=Low Saxon (Low German), S=Scots, Sh=Shetlandic
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From: Stefan Israel [stefansfeder at yahoo.com]
Subject: "Language varieties" LOWLANDS-L

Ron wrote:

> As you know, we rarely broadcast non-subscribers'
> communication and even more rarely allow non-subscribers to
> participate in our projects.  However, I feel that we need to
> resolve the matter regarding recognition of Zeelandic (Zeeuws)

>
> At any rate, I believe we should, at the very least, include a
> Zeelandic (Zeeuws) version of our welcoming page, since this
> alone does not necessarily mean that we consider a given
> variety a separate language, as proven by our inclusion of
> translations in more than one Low Saxon and Scots variety.

That might be a useful approach right there- Simply stop
worrying about which varieties to designate a separate language,
and simply refer to -varieties- of Lowland languages.  Standard
Dutch and Zeeuws, Platt or dialects of Platt, they are all
related varieties.  Why worry on the website about academic, or
highly political, arguments about which should be called a
language?

I in any event welcome more Lowland varieties, and would
encourage us not to focus too heavily on sharp (and artificial)
distinctions between these related varieties).

Stefan Israel
stefansfeder at yahoo.com

Rons Frage: Soll die Lowlands-Webseite Zeeuws als eigene Sprache
aufnehmen oder als Dialekt (d.h. Dialekt von Niederländisch)?
Viele Sprecher von Zeeuws (Zeeland) betrachten Zeeuws als eigene
Sprache.  Meine vorgeschlagene Lösung lautet, nennen wir alle
Sprachvarietäten einfach als Sprachvarietäten und versuchen wir
gar nicht festzulegen, welche als selbständige Sprachen zu
bezeichnen- der Unterschied zwischen verwandten Sprache und
verwandten Mundarten ist eher eine akademische oder politische
und macht uns nur unnötige Probleme.
Die grundlegende Frage war eigentlich, hat jemand etwas dagegen,
dass die Webseite Zeeuws aufnimmt, und zwar mit Hilfe von einem
in Zeeuws engagierten Nichtmitglied?

Ich selber begrüsse neue Arten von Lowslandssprachen, und wäre
dafür, einen Bogen um die unlösbare Debatte von Sprache/Dialekt
zu machen, zumindest was die Webseite angeht.

Stefan Israel
stefansfeder at yahoo.com

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From: R. F. Hahn [sassisch at yahoo.com]
Subject: Language varieties

Stefan,

Thanks for your input (above).  I quite agree with what you said.  Besides,
it is consistent with what we have been practising already, certainly with
regard to the welcoming pages.  With the online and offline resource pages,
however, we have been going by what most agree to be languages.  But I
don't see any reason not to post Zeelandic guides, irrespective of the ins
and outs of language politics.  One of the stated goals of Lowlands-L is to
support minority language endeavors within the Lowlandic range as much as
possible.  Given that there are strong feelings in favor of seeing
Zeelandic as a language in its own right, this is one of those situations.

In the meantime, Marco Evenhuis has joined LL-L, and I want to welcome him
on everyone's behalf, also all other people that recently joined (an
increasing number from countries of the former Soviet Union, by the way).
I invite Marco or anyone else to send me a Zeelandic translation of our
welcoming page, and I will post it as soon as possible.  Also, I look
forward to receiving more information about Zeelandic.

Best regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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