LL-L "Etymology" 2002.12.08 (03) [D/E]
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L O W L A N D S - L * 08.DEC.2002 (03) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic
V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: burgdal32admin <burgdal32 at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2002.12.07 (01) [E]
> From: Marcel Bas <mrbas_26 at hotmail.com>
> Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2002.12.06 (02) [E]
>
> Theo,
>
> I should add something to the etymology of the Dutch word _pink_:
> another source, Jan de Vries's Etymologisch Woordenboek van de
> Nederlandse
> Taal, says that the word might be deriving from the word _pin_,
> because of
> its narrow, small shape.
> In Old English _pinca_ means 'point', which also derives from _pin_.
> The
> etymology is uncertain, but I happen to like my own hypothesis, of the
> word
> being preserved by children's language :p
>
> Regards, Marcel.
>
> ----------
>
> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Etymology
>
> Marcel, Theo, Lowlanders,
>
> Let's not forget that Scottish and American English, too, has "pinky
> (finger)" ~ "pinkie (finger)" for "little finger," assumedly emanating
> from
> Scots _pink(ie)_, and that American English got it from Scottish
> immigrants.
>
> In Scots, besides "little finger," _pinkie_ and (earlier?) _pink_ can
> denote
> anything small, also 'narrowed', 'peering' and 'winking' of eyes (cf.
> Dutch
> _pinken_ 'to wink'), and in addition the verb: intransitively denoting
> 'to
> fall' (of small objects, such as drops), and transitively denoting 'to
> strike with a small object so as to make a sharp, piercing sound.'
>
> I am wondering if Dutch and Scots just happen to have preserved the
> above or
> if it has something to do with Dutch-Scots contacts, such as medieval
> "Flemish" emigration to Scotland.
>
> Regards,
> Reinhard/Ron
>
Dear Marcel and Ron,
This is what i found in my Flemish dict. : De Bo (1892)
-Pinkel (wvl pijnkel)m. - Hetzelfde of pink, kleenste vinger. De pinkel
kwetsen.
-Wimper, vlegger, pinkhaar
-Houten tapje of spietje dat
men door het uiteinde van eene schee steekt om te beletten dat er een
ander stuk van afwijke, juist gelijk men eene luns in den as steekt om
er het wiel op te houden, of gelijk men een scheers steekt door eenen
drilbout. Het is bij middel van pinkels in de uiteinden van de schee'n
eener wiek, dat de mulders het buitenzoom op die schee'n gevestigd
houden.
-Pingel, ook pinkel (wvl pijngel, pijnkel)m. - Dunne reep, lijn, lange
sterke koorde van eenen vinger dik. Met pingels haalt men ijzeren
staven naar omhoog b.v. op een dak. Pingels om het zeil van eenen
windmolen open te houden. ...
-pingeling, pinkeling, m. en o. Zoo heet elke streng of pees van eene
koord.
-pinkelen (wvl pijnkelen) Frequent. van pinken, dit is -flikkeren,
glinsteren, tintelen. De sterren pinkelen. De ijsel aan de bomen
pinkelt als er de zon op schingt.
-vonkelen,perelen, mierlen, sprekende van
dranken. De champagne-wijn pinkelt in de glazen. Oud bier dat pinkelt.
-prikkelen, tintelen, iets smertelijks gevoelen
als van duizende naaldesteken. Mijn vingers pinkeleden van de koude.
We know als a little poem about fingers:
Ik ga slapen - zei Duimerloot (=duim)
Ik heb nog niet geëten - zei Lekkerpoot (=wijsvinger)
Waar gaan we't krijgen - zei Langerakel (=langerebbe, = middelvinger)
In moërtjes schapra - zei Kortekrakel (= Kieremachuit, = ringvinger)
'k Ga't klappen - zei Kleenkernuit (= pink)
Greetings
Luc Vanbrabant
Oekene
----------
From: Sandy Fleming [sandy at scotstext.org]
Subject: "Etymology"
> From: ntl <shoogly at ntlworld.com>
> Subject: LL-L "Help needed" 2002.12.06 (14) [E]
>
> "Gallous / Gallus " is very much a Glasgow word. I am from and grew up in
> Edinburgh - and have never heard it used in this area - in fact we see the
> word "gallus" as being very Glaswegian. Here we use the word "barrie" with
While "gallus" (/'ga:l at s/, written "gallows" in traditional
texts) has been borrowed from Scots into Glasgow English and
is used copiously in Glasgow, but it's common in the Scots of
other areas. At our school in East Lothian (well to the east
of Edinburgh) "gallus" was one of those "pantomime words"
which became the cause of endless, pointless argument:
"I'm gallus, you'r no."
"Ye ar nut gallus, son, I'm gallus!"
"I'm gallus!"
"Ye ar nur!"
"I am sut!
&c &c &c
It was also the subject of furtuve discussion about the new
boy or anyone else whose status in the pecking order was in
doubt, to determine whether they were "gallus" enough to be
seen with.
"Gallus" meaning "rough, cheerful, OK, part of the 'in' crowd"
is really the same word as "gallus" (gallows, meaning the thing
people are hanged on, also pronounced /'ga:l at s/ in Scots) through
a few semantic processes. Originally "gallus" started to be used
as an adjective to mean anyone who might end up on the gallows,
as in Burns's "The Author's Earnest Cry an Prayer":
Is there, that bears the name o Scot,
But feels his hert's bluid risin hot,
To see his puir auld mither's pot
Thus dung in staves,
An plunder'd o her hindmaist groat
By gallows knaves?
There's a natural process of semantic weakening which takes
place when one generation gets a habit of exaggerating a word,
with the result that the next generation understands it as
meaning something weaker (for example, "soon" in English used
to mean "immediately", but with people saying "I'll do it soon"
and not doing it for a while, later generations understood it
to mean "in a little while"). It would seem that some generation
of Scots started using "gallus" for people they only mildly
disapproved of, so the word came to mean "cool!" to children who
approved of people their parents didn't like.
Again from the word "gallows", "gallus" was generalised to mean
various kinds of supporting brace (also the verb "gallussed"
meaning supported using such a brace). The most common use of
this today is as "galluses" /'ga:l at sIz/ - braces for holding up
trousers - but in the past it was also used for such things as
shoulder-straps for carrying fish-baskets and the wooden yoke
for carrying pails of milk or water - a milkmaid's yoke was
referred to as "galluses".
As an aside, another "pantomime word" used copiously at our
school was "hacket", meaning "not good-looking enough to go
out with", eg:
"How div ye no tak Brenda tae the picturs?"
"Na, she's hacket!"
Usually this meant the responder is desperately in love with the
boy/girl in question but determined to deny it (and if you're
reading this, Fiona, I didn't mean it! :\
Sandy
http://scotstext.org/
----------
From: Tom Mc Rae <t.mcrae at uq.net.au>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2002.12.07 (01) [E]
On Saturday, December 7, 2002, at 04:33 PM, ntl <shoogly at ntlworld.com>
wrote
> "Gallous / Gallus " is very much a Glasgow word. I am from and grew up
> in
> Edinburgh - and have never heard it used in this area - in fact we see
> the
> word "gallus" as being very Glaswegian.
Like you I am born and bred in Edinburgh and can assure you the term
was in use among Working Class folks as late as the early 1970's when I
left for Australia. I recall it being used in the Prestonfield and
Canongate areas when I was a kid in the 1940's. I will concede it is
probably a Glescae term that was adopted just like the ubiquitous
'Ginger' for any sort of fizzy drink, luckily this latter never quite
caught on.
'Heh Jimmy, gies a boattle o' ginjuh'. 'OK whoat kind dae Ye wa't ?'
Regards
Tom Mc Rae (Boarn Buccleuch street. Breed Prestonfield. Steyed The Inch
an Shandon efter that)
----------
From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology
I wrote about Lowlands Saxon (Low German) _pingeln_:
> Please consider as a parallel case English onomatopoetic “ping” describing
> something small (especially something metallic, such as a ring or a coin)
> producing a sound upon impact when falling or when being struck (such as a
> small bell). Though I cannot attest to the existence of a simple verbal
> derivative *_pingen_ (*/piN-/ *“to make the sound ‘ping’ once”), I know
that
> Lowlands Saxon has the iterative derivation _pingeln_ (/piN-l-/ “to make
the
> sound ‘ping’ several times” =) ‘to ring’ (also _anpingeln_ “to ring on” =
> ‘to ring a doorbell’) and the nominal form _Pingel_ ‘(small) bell’,
> ‘doorbell’ (as opposed to _beiern_ ‘to ring’ in reference to a large bell,
> _Klock_, _beiern_ also denoting ‘to swing’, such as the motion of a
> pendulum). In this connection please also consider Dutch _pingelen_ ‘to
> haggle’ and _pingelaar_ ‘haggler’, perhaps originally referring to an
> itinerant salesperson that announced his or her arrival by ringing a bell.
I suppose that if 'to haggle' and 'haggler' are correct (as found in Dutch
dictionaries), the meaning must be derived from 'to peddle' ~ 'to hawk' and
'peddlar' ~ 'hawker' respectively (if these are not the meanings nowadays as
well), because it would be a peddlar or hawker who would engage in both
"haggling" and _pingelen_ ("ringing a small bell").
Luc (above):
> -Pinkel (wvl pijnkel)m. - Hetzelfde of pink, kleenste vinger. De pinkel
> kwetsen.
Incidentally, this reminds me of Lowlands Saxon _Pinkel_, a type of sausage.
Is there any connection, and, if not, what might be the etymology?
_Pinkel_ is eaten in various parts of Lower Saxony (i.e., the German *state*
of Lower Saxony), mostly in the western parts (Bremen, Oldenburg and Eastern
Friesland), also in the Lunenburg region, usually accompanied by kale
(_Gröönkohl_, German _Grünkohl_, Dutch _boerenkool_). In some localities it
is "simply" what elsewhere is called _Kohlwost_ ~ _Kohlwoss_ (German
_Kohlwurst_ "cabbage sausage," where "cabbage" includes kale and some other
winter-time cruciferous greens), a thin, firm sausage stuffed mostly with
bacon and/or salt pork and then smoked, to be simmered in kale or other
types of winter greens. "Typical" _Pinkel_, however, is a small
("small-finger-like"?) type of sausage stuffed with various types of meat
(including offal), fat and groats (in intestinal casing) -- a tiny brother
of the good, old Scottish haggis perhaps, both as far as the stuffing is
concerned and in that it has a reputation for being an "acquired taste"
among non-locals. _Pinkel_ with kale is *the* Christmas time fare in the
western parts of Lower Saxony.
Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
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