LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.07.22 (01) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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From: "Wim" <wkv at home.nl>
Subject: LL-L "Pronomina" 2002.07.21 (01) [E]

-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
From: erek gass <egass at caribline.com>
Subject: LL-L "Pronomina" 2002.07.20 (01) [E]

Then, too, there are "random covergences", e.g. Italian "donna" =
Japanese "onna".

-------------------------------

 from wkv at home.nl
wim verdoold

Makes indonesian : nonja

W!m

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From: "Roman Laryushkin" <puka_2000 at mail.ru>
Subject: LL-L "Pronomina" 2002.07.21 (01) [E]

> From: UB82DN at aol.com
> Subject: LL-L "Pronomina" 2002.07.20 (01) [E]
>
> Liewe Laaglanders,
>
> The pronoun series: 1st person in -m-, 2d person -s- or -t-, 3rd person
> various, runs through Indo-European and a number of neighboring language
> families. This could be taken as evidence for wider grouping into
> "superfamilies" like Nostratic (there are other proposals). Perhaps the
> best short introduction is M. Kaiser and V. Sheveroshkin, "Nostratic,"
> _Annual Review of Anthropology_, 17 (1988), pp. 309-329.
>
> Soviet linguists were especially open to such hypotheses, as in the
> works of V. Illic-Svityc, A. Dolgopolsky, and V. Sheveroshkin. There is
> a massive
> reconstruction of Indo-European linguistics by Gamkrelidze and Ivanov
> (esp.
> phonology) with big implications for macro-family research. The work of
> the
> Americans Joseph Greenberg and Merritt Ruhlen should also be mentioned.
>
> We may be dealing with deep-layered genetic relationships in the pronoun
> similarities between I.E. and Finno-Ugric.
>
> Cheers,
> Joe Stromberg
>
>

Ron!
You've mentioned Mongolian language among others, that, alongside with
Germanic, had one ancestor. I looked through Mongolian dictionary and
discovered interesting things there.

Adjectival suffix -ijn reminded me English suffix -(i)an and French
-ienne. For
example:
(E) American, Asian - (M) Amerikijn, Azijn

Personal pronoun "thou" is "chi" which reminds Russian "ty" ~ Italian
"tu" ~
German "du"

Possessive pronoun "my" in Mongolian is  "minij, min'"

The word "owl" is "uul'"

The word "shoes" is "shaahaj"

The word "air" is "agaar"

The word "time" is "tsag" ~ German "Zeit"

The word "any, every" is "al' ch" ~ Dutch "elk"

The word "part" is "tal" ~ german "Teil"

Too much for coincidences. By the way, I know there's a subscriber from
Mongolia, maybe he can give another examples or to object me?

P.S. Ron, I hope you won't kick me off because of talking too much about
non-lowlands languages ;-)

Roman Laryushkin,
Simferopol, Ukraine

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language varieties

Hi, Roman!

When you look at the Mongolic varieties you have to trace each word back
to literary/classical Mongolian which preserves forms as they were
before they came to be incredibly contracted, and unfortunately Khalkha
Mongolian (the standard language of Mongolia) is one of the most extreme
"contractors"; e.g., _uul'_ < _uGuli_ 'owl' (however, cf. Old Saxon
_ûla_, Old English _ûle_, Old Norse _ugla_ 'owl').

> P.S. Ron, I hope you won't kick me off because of talking too much
> about non-lowlands languages ;-)

Kicked off you won't be.  But, yes, stop it we must.  There is a time
and place for everything.  The Nostratic List or some such list would be
more welcoming and appropriate.  Bear in mind that most people are not
inclined to stretch that far and are not tolerant of other people doing
so.

Just a word on the way:

(1) When it comes to such theories and ideas (which are, literally
speaking, "far-fetched," no matter which side you are standing on), you
get basically two types of people: (1) those that want to believe, and
(2) those that do not want to believe -- thus, it's a bit like religion
-- and each side will try hard to make their beliefs reality.

(2) Opponents have the advantages of being able to "debunk" by means of
ridicule and by means of dismissing everything remarkable as
coincidence, borrowing or global onomatopoeia (as in the case of 'owl'
above), all of which is easy because we are dealing with very, very
nebulous, pre-historic things, and in so long a distance there can be
any amount of interfering static, such as personal philosophies and
beliefs.

This is an age-old game, and many people just get tired of it after a
while, just keep quietly worshipping in their respective temples.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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