LL-L "Etymology" 2003.08.28 (02) [E/LS]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 28.AUG.2003 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Friedrich-Wilhelm Neumann <Fieteding at gmx.net>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2003.08.26 (02) [F/LS]

(English below)

Dank Dii, Henno,

föör Diin kompleet Verkloor'n von dennen "Eeiboor".

Wiiter mit de Vooagels:

De (UG): "Basstölpel" (ook'n interessanten Noom'n, schall woll
Skandinaav'sch ween), (E): "Gannet" heeit opp Hollandsch (D): "Jan van
Gent".
Woneem hett hey dissen Noom'n heer?

***
English:

Thanks, Henno,

for Your complete explanations about the "White Stork".

Going on in birds:

the (UG): "Basstoelpel" (interesting name; could be Skandinavian), (E):
"Gannet", is the "Jan van Gent" in Dutch.

Where did "she" (as I've learned from Ron!) get this name from?

Greutens/regards

Fiete.

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

[English below]

Moyen, Fiete!

> Where did "she" (as I've learned from Ron!) get this name from?

:)  _She_ man bloots in nich-standart-dialekten un in olde leyder un
segwysen!

> De (UG): "Basstölpel" (ook'n interessanten Noom'n, schall woll
Skandinaav'sch ween),

Villicht ook nich.  Wen Du wöyrd'böyker nich myden wöyrst (:)), den schulst
wul weten, dat 't Düytsche wourd _Tölpel_ ('dööskop', 'döösbaddel',
'val-in-d'n-bry', 'tüffel', 'dalf', "tapsbüydel") as Nedder-Vranksch
anvungen har, vun 't Old-Vlaamsche _dorper(e)_ (= "dörpbewahner" =
Vranzöyssch _vilain_) över Middel-Düytsch _dorpære_ > _dörper_ > _dörpel_ ~
_törpel_ kamen is.

Of _Basstölpel_ nu mit düt wourd _Tölpel_ verwandt is, dat kan ik nich vör
wiss seggen.  Dey zooloogsche naam is _Sula bassana_, 'n ünnergrup vun dey
_Tölpel_-grup (_Sulidae_).  Den het _Basstölpel_ amend wat mit de
Bass-Straat or allgemeyn wat mit d'n man Bass tou douen.  Up Yslandsch un
Feröysch heytt dey vagel _súla_, up Norweegsch _havsule_/_havsula_
("sey-sule/sula"), up Sweedsch _havssula_ ("sey-sule"), up Deensch _sule_.
Nu süyt hey asig tapsig un dösig (man ook drullig) uut, un daar wegen neem
ik an, dat _Tölpel_ un _Basstölpel_ wul mit dat annere wourd' verwandt sünd.
Dat bewyst villicht ook dey Vranzöyssche naam _fou de bassan_.

Un nu myn vraag' an Dy: Wou heytt dey vagel in *use* spraak?

Gröytens,
Reinhard/Ron

***

Hi, Fiete!

> Where did "she" (as I've learned from Ron!) get this name from?

:)  "She" only in non-standard dialects and in old songs and sayings.

> the (UG): "Basstoelpel" (interesting name; could be Skandinavian),

Perhaps not.  If you weren't avoiding dictionaries as much as as you are
(:)) you'd know that the German word _Tölpel_ ('clumsy person', 'klutz')
started off Lower Franconian, derived from Old Flemish _dorper(e)_
('villager' = French _vilain_) via Middle German _dorpære_ > _dörper_ >
_dörpel_ ~ _törpel_.

I can't be sure that _Basstölpel_ is related to this word _Tölpel_.  The
zoological name is _Sula bassana_, a subcategory of the _Sulidae_ group.  So
_Basstölpel_ might be connected with the Bass Straight or generally with the
person Bass (?).  In Icelandic and Faeroese the bird is called _súla_, in
Norwegian _havsule_/_havsula_ ("ocean sule/sula"), in Swedish _havssula_
("ocean sula"), in Danish _sule.  The bird looks awfully awkward (though
also kind of cute), and it is because of this that I assume _Tölpel_ and
_Basstölpel_ do have something to do with the other word.  Also, this seems
to be indicated by the French name _fou de bassan_.

And now my question to you: What is the bird called in *our* language?

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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