LL-L "Etymology" 2003.02.06 (05) [E]

Thu Feb 6 17:10:03 UTC 2003

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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
 L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
 S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: dujardin <dujardin at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2003.02.05 (09) [D/E]

Aardig

In het Westvlaams is "oardig" zondermeer negatief en nooit positief.
"an oardigaard" is "a weird or strange guy".

denis dujardin
westvlaanderen

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From: Holger Weigelt <platt at holger-weigelt.de>
Subject: "Lexical usage"

> From: Marco Evenhuis <evenhuis at zeelandnet.nl>
> Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2003.02.04 (14) [E/S]
>
> Elsie wrote:
>
> >Your explanation below reminds me of the Afrikaans word "orig": In
certain
> >geographical areas it means 'nuisance/ peculiar / irritating' but in
others
> >the meaning 'left over / redundant' predominates.
> >I don't find the equivalent in Dutch. A Scots influence on Afrikaans?
>
> In Zeeuws/Zeelandic, we have the word _aorig_ which sounds exactly the
same
> as Afrikaans _orig_. It means 'strange'or 'peculiar', usually in a
somewhat
> negative way. _Een aorigen_ is a 'strange, awkward person'. So my guess is
> that Afrikaans _orig_ in the first meaning mentioned by Elsie comes from
> Zeelandic _aorig_.
> For the second meaning I think of the Dutch word _overig_ (from _over_; in
> Afrikaans: _oor_).
>
> From the 'Woordenboek der Zeeuwse Dialecten' (Den Haag 1959-65), p. 8:
> "aerdig, aordig, aorig: 1. eigenaardig, vreemd, raar, zonderling. ''t Is
mae
> een aorig nistje": het is een raar, wonderlijk, gek, naar geval. (...)
> Aant.: 'raor' (raar) wordt ook gehoord, maar is beduidend moderner. In de
> Algemeen Nederlandse betekenis van 'aardig' (lief, vermakelijk, grappig)
> kiest de echte dialectspreker andere woorden. 2. onpasselijk, onlekker,
> misselijk, ziek. 'Piertje aa vier borren snert op en vuuf 'ard ekookt'
> eiers, mae toen wier n toch een bitje aorig'."
>
> Regards,
>
> Marco
>
Hello all !
We have the same word "oeriğ" or "oereğ" in Eastern Friesland Low Saxon.
It's meaning is: strange, peculiar. But it is also a component of the word
"oeriğkaid" which means: joy, delight.
Examples: 'T is 'n oeriğkaid = it is delightful;
häi hâr d'r sīn  oeriğkaid fan = he felt dilighted by...
Greetings
Holger

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From: Roger Thijs, Euro-Support, Inc. <roger.thijs at euro-support.be>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2003.02.05 (09) [D/E]

>From: Floor en Lyanne van Lamoen <f.v.lamoen at wxs.nl>
>Subject: LL-L "Lexical usage" 2003.02.05 (06) [E]
>For the first meaning: the word 'aardig' in Dutch kan be used in a
negative way as well, although this use is regional, from 'weird' and
'unusual' to 'nauseous/sick'. Even in Westerlauer Frisian 'aardich' can
have negative meaning. Of course the /aa/ in aardig may sound like /oo/
in many dialects. I think that thus it is very likely that this is, as
Marco suggests, the origin of the first meaning you mention for 'orig'.
-----
>From: Mathieu van Woerkom <mathieu.vanwoerkom at student.kun.nl>
>Subject: Lexical usage
>Misschien nog leuk om op te merken dat het Nederlandse woord 'aardig'
vroeger een heel andere betekenis had dan nu: het betekende meer zoiets als
'eigenaardig', 'raar'. "Een aardige vrouw" betekende toen dus zo ongeveer
"Zij is gek". Ik weet het fijne hier niet van, anderen wel? Misschien dat
deze ouderwetse betekenis in het Zeeuws nog enigszins bewaard is gebleven
als 'aorig'...
------

In my dialect (West-Limburgish) the word is only known with a negative
content (close to "eigenaardig" in Dutch). We just didn't drop the "d" but
dropped the "r".

"Das en oodige vrouw": That's a strange (= behaving, looking abnormally)
women.
(Sound of the o: a long version of the Dutch "short o").

Regards,
Roger

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From: Thomas <t.mcrae at uq.net.au>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2003.02.05 (02) [E]

on 6/2/03 1:47, Lowlands-L at admin at lowlands-l.net wrote:

> I assume that Scots _doo_ is related to English "dove."
I can't help wondering if it came to us via the Flemish settlers although
that is rather wild speculation on my part.
Regards
Tom
Tom Mc Rae PSOC
Brisbane Australia
"The masonnis suld mak housis stark and rude,
To keep the pepill frome the stormes strang,
And he that fals, the craft it gois all wrang."
>From 15th century Scots Poem 'The Buke of the Chess'

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

In Lowlands Saxon (Low German) there is the now somewhat archaic expression
_... hett Aard_ (~ _... hett Oort_) "... has way/manner/sort," meaning that
{subject} is good/nice.  In older language varieties you will find
expressions such as _hett gode aard_ ("has good sort"), _van fîner aard_
("of fine sort"), etc.  Theoretically at least, this could also be negative:
*_van leyger aard_ (*"of bad sort").  However, it seems that these
expressions with _aard_ have developed in such a way that a positive meaning
is inherent (default) and the adjective could be omitted.  Similarly, the
adjectival/adverbial derivative _aardig_ (~ _oordig_ ~ _orrig_ ~ _orig_
"sorty") has an inherently positive connotation, thus 'good', 'nice',
'fine', 'well-mannered', 'obedient' (cf. German _Art_ 'sort' > _artig_
'good' > 'well-behaved', 'obedient').

You could use a different adjective with _Aard_, such as _snaaksch_
'peculiar', 'weird', 'strange'.  Judging by what some of you have said about
Low Franconian, it seems as though this became the inherent, default meaning
in those varieties.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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