LL-L "Names" 2003.01.09 (04) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

======================================================================
 L O W L A N D S - L * 09.JAN.2003 (04) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
 http://www.lowlands-l.net * admin at lowlands-l.net * Encoding: Unicode UTF-8
 Rules & Guidelines: http://www.lowlands-l.net/rules.htm
 Posting Address: lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org
 Server Manual: http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html
 Archive: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html
=======================================================================
 You have received this because you have been subscribed upon request.
 To unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l" as message
 text from the same account to <listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org> or
 sign off at <http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html>.
=======================================================================
 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
 L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
 S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
=======================================================================

From: Goaitsen van der Vliet <goaitsen at home.nl>
Subject: Eavelgönne, euvelgunne, övelgönne, övelgunne, etc.


Help needed

There is an ancient Twents word 'eavelgönne' that can not be found in any
dictionary. Someone from the place Oldenzaal said it meant 'a (swampy) piece
of land with bad drainage'.

To me it seems this word has the same etymology as 'Euvelgunne' in
Groningen, and many different forms of places and names in northern Germany
(ovelgunne, ovelgonne, owelgunne, övelgunne, övelgunne, ovelgönne,
ovelgünne, ubelgunne, ubelgonne, obelgonne, overgonne, overgunne).

In different sources I found different meanings, for instance: ill-favour,
with a bad name, but I doubt that meaning.
It is clear to me that the first part of the word is related to the English
word 'evil' and the Dutch 'euvel' (both meaning  'bad').
But how about the second part, 'gunne' or 'gonne'? Can it be something like
'stream'?
'Gunne' is the name of a stream near Paderborn.
Many of the places called 'euvelgunne', 'ovelgonne' etc. are located at the
border of an old stream.

Does someone has this low saxon word in her/his vocabulary, and what exactly
does it mean then?

Goaitsen van der Vliet, Enschede NL

goaitsen at home.nl
Voorpagina: http://members.home.nl/goaitsen
De Oare útjouwerij (De Andere uitgeverij):
http://members.home.nl/goaitsen/oare
De Nieje Tied (blad in t plat): http://members.home.nl/goaitsen/dnt

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Names

Goaitsen,

Northern Germany there are Ovelgönne (between Bremen and the Jadebusen),
Övelgönne (just southwest of Hamborg/Hamburg), Ovelgünne (near
Maideborg/Magdeburg in Saxony-Anhalt) and Ebelgünde (in
Branneborg/Brandenburg, west of Berlin, at the northwestern edge of the
Havelland).

We discussed this group of place names a long time ago, but for some reason
I am unable to find it in the archives.  I think the consensus at the time
was that it meant something like "swampy/evil-smelling slough."*  For it to
be so widespread a name it must have been a commonly used geographic or
topographic term at some time.

* A slough is a muddy stream or pool.

Reinhard/Ron

==================================END===================================
* Please submit postings to <lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org>.
* Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
* Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
* Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l") are
  to be sent to <listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org> or at
  <http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html>.
 =======================================================================