LL-L "Morphology" 2004.01.26 (01) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 26.JAN.2004 (01) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: Frédéric Baert <baert_frederic at CARAMAIL.COM>
Subject: LL-L "Morphology" 2004.01.23 (03) [E]

Uilleam and Ron wrote:
>From: Gaidheal <gaidheal at yahoo.com>
>Subject: Not sure how to categorize this
>
>Feasgar math, a Lowlanders;
>
>I just thought of something that I think may be worth investigating. I
>noticed that the French
>conditional is made by combining the future stem and the imperfect endings.
>E.g.: AIMER, to love,
>like. AIMER- is the future stem. -AIS, -AIS, -AIT, -IONS, -IEZ, -AIENT are
>the imperfective
>endings. The former plus the latter forms the conditional.
>
>In English, there is the auxiliary verb WILL. Will, when put into the past
>tense, becomes WOULD.
>Would is the auxiliary verb for the conditional tense! This means that like
>'imperfectizing' the
>future in French makes the conditional, in English 'pastizing' the future
>auxiliary makes the
>conditional auxiliary.
>
>The question before all of you: Is this French influence on English, a
>Germanic way of making the
>conditional that the Franks adopted into Latin to replace the old
imperfect,
>or simply a
>coincidence?
>
>Magno studio responsiones vestras exspecto!
>
>Beannachdan,
>Uilleam Òg mhic Sheumais.
>
>----------
>
>From: R. F. Hahn lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
>Subject: Morphology
>
>Uilleam,
>
>I don't have the answer for you, but I can tell you that conditional
>construction in Lowlands Saxon (Low German) and English (and Northumbrian
>and Scots?) are pretty similar, though in the recent past the LS system of
>many dialects has been disturbed by German influences, e.g. ...
>
>willen: wil -> wul   (to be willing/keen to: will -> would)
>Hey wul dat nich doun.
>He did not want to do it/that.
>He would not do it/that. (cond.)
>
>könen: kan -> kun   (to be able to: can -> could)
>Hey kun dat nich doun.
>He could not/was not able to do it/that.
>He could not do that. (cond.)
>
>schölen: schal (~ sal) -> schul (~ sul)   (to be required to: schall ->
>schuld)
>Hey schul dat nich doun.
>He was not supposed to do it/that.
>He schould not do it/that. (cond.)
>
>mögen: mag -> mug  (to be permitted/able to: may -> was permitted/able
to --
>to feel like: feel like -> felt like)
>Hey mug dat nich doun.
>He was not allowed to do it/that.  as well as ...
>He did not want to do it/that.  He did not feel like doing it/that.
>He would not be allowed do it/that. (cond.)
>
>
>hebben: het -> (had >) har (to have: has -> had)
>
>Hey het dat nich daan.
>He has not done it/that. ~ He did not do it.
>
>Hey har dat nich daan.
>He had not done it/that.
>
>Hey har dat nich daan kund.
>He could not have done it/that.
>
>By the way, _schölen_ and (if there is no confusion with 'to want') also
>_willen_ are the original future tense markers, as in English; e.g., ...
>
>Hey schal dat doun.
>He will/shall do it/that.  or ...
>(Also: He shall (= must) do it/that.)
>
>He wil dat doun.
>He will do it/that.
>(also: He wants to to it/that.)
>
>More recently, under German influence, _warden_ (German _werden_) 'to
>become' is used in many or most dialects:
>
>Hey wardt dat doun.
>(G: Er wird es/das tun.)
>He will do it/that.
>
>Hey wöyrd' dat doun.
>(G: Er würde es/das tun.)
>He would do it/that. (cond.)
>
>Wherever there is no stress on future and there is no danger of confusion,
>the future tense is expressed in the same way as the present tense:
>
>Hey dayt dat.
>He does it/that.  or ...
>He'll do it/that.
>
>Regards,
>Reinhard/Ron

Hi to all

I also have a question concerning an eventual influence of Franks on French.
French language has two ways to express the future aspect of a verb :
a tense we call "futur simple" inherited from Latine : to the verb stem, we
add the future endings -ai, -as, -a, -ons, -ez, -ont.
For example the verb "aimer" (to love) will be :
J'aimerai
tu aimeras
il aimera
nous aimerons
vous aimerez
ils aimeront.

But there is another way to express the future aspect in french. We use
what we call a "verbe auxiliaire". In this case the verb "aller" (to go).
We use it at the present and behind the verb at the infinitive. We express
by this way an intentional future :
je vais aimer
tu vas aimer
il va aimer
nous allons aimer
vous allez aimer
ils vont aimer

In west Flemish in France, future tense is expressed by the same way :
'k gaen kommen (I will come)
gy gaet kommen (you will come)
etc...

So the question is, do other latine languages have such a way to express
future or is French the only to have it. In this case, it might be one more
feature of Frankish influence on French which makes it the "most germanic
of the latine languages" as i read it in a book about evolution of the
French.

Cheers
Frédéric Baert

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