LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.29 (02) [A/D/E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 29.JUL.2004 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: Liza du Plooy <lizaduplooy at yahoo.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (02) [E/Italian]


Middag almal

Mark het geskryf:
"We say, 'Geen sant in sy eie land.' It is a straight quote from the Bible,
&
the English says, 'A prophet is not without honour, except in his own
country.' Jesus was quoting a Jewish expression.

In Afrikaans 'sant' means saint, but it is rarely used. We have a preference
for 'heilige', as we do for all terms & roots of Teutonic origin.
However, the application of the expression is fairly loose. A young man may
be held in great respect, except in his own household, & if he notes this,
someone will quote that at him.
There are many such words in Afrikaans that survive only in 'old saws', like
this. Another is 'ros en ruiter', meaning 'horse & rider', though the ag
Afrikaans for 'horse' is 'perd' "

As kind het ek altyd gedink die spreekwoord lui "geen sand in sy eie land"
en was vasoortuig dat dit na mense in die reënwoude verwys. Dit was 'n
redelike ontnugtering toe ma my verduidelik het dat dit sant met 'n t is.
:-)

I've never heard the expression "ros en ruiter" myself that I can remember,
but I do of course know the word "roskam" which I knew had something to do
with a horse. According to my (horrible) Afrikaans/English dictionary:
Roskam (W) : currycomb (horse); criticise severely.
Of course now I am tickled to know what the word for horse is in other
lowlands languages!

Liza du Plooy

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From: Liza du Plooy <lizaduplooy at yahoo.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (11) [E]


Denis wrote:
"In Danish the Garden is a "have". In Dutch we have the expression " ze
vetrokken met have en goed" , meaning "they left for an unknown destination,
taking with them everything which was valuable for them. The word have as
such is not used anymore. Only in this expression."

Running with the idea that gardens are safe and enclosed places, would the
Afrikaanse word "hawe" (harbour) be related at all?

Liza du Plooy

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From: David Barrow <davidab at telefonica.net.pe>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (08) [D/E]

>From: GoodbyColumbus at aol.com <GoodbyColumbus at aol.com>
>Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (07) [D/E]
>
>In a message dated 7/28/04 3:54:27 PM Central Daylight Time,
>lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net writes:
>
>  If I am not mistaken, English "guard," "ward," and "warden" also come
from
>  the same root as "garden" and "yard."
>
>Yes, but by way of Old French "guarder" (garder), Old North French
'warder',
>both of Teutonic origin.
>
>Here's another etymology I found, Old French 'gardin' (F. jardin), of
>Teutonic origin as well.

yard, garden, hort- are from IE 'gher' to grasp, enclose.  ward, warden,
guard, guardian are from IE 'wer' percieve, watch out for.

David Barrow

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From: Mari Sarv <mari at haldjas.folklore.ee>
Subject: "Etymology"

> From: denis dujardin <dujardin at pandora.be>
> Subject: etymology
>
> Hi Lowlanders,
>
> In dutch there is this expression : "geen sant in eigen land", meaning
> "no one is a prophet in his own country".
> The word "sant" is fascinating. I know that in Swedish, "det är sant" ,
> means, "it is true".
> Can anybody refer me to other words in other Lowland languages that
> might contain the same stem or have the same meaning?
>
> Denis Dujardin
> West-Flanders

In Estonian "sant" (<LS) means 'people who are going around in
*st*-martins and st-catherins eve ("mardisant", "kadrisant") and on other
similar occasions; they are singing and dancing and *getting some food* in
each house'.But in other days it means 'beggar', most commonly 'crippled'.

Mari Sarv

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From: denis dujardin <dujardin at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (11) [E]

About Boom-gaard or Orchard. I have to make a correction.
Our Orchards in Flanders are mainly with hedges. Originally with hawthorn:
later and now mainly with privet (Ligustrum).
This is not necessaraly the main typology of orchards. They might also be
"open" of course.

Does anybody allready have a reference about "lochting", which is more
widespread then Westflemish?

Denis Dujardin

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From: HALLS Haeng-Cho <zzhhalls at student.uq.edu.au>
Subject:


I'm wondering if that word lochting is somehow related to the German word
Lichtung in the sense of a `clearing' in a forest?

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From: Luc Hellinckx <luc.hellinckx at pandora.be>
Subject: Etymology

Beste liëglanners,

Another interesting word for "garden" is the popular Flemish term
"lochting", "lochten" < Middle Dutch "lochtuun" ~ older English "leighton",
Old English "lēac-tūn". Litterally the word means "look-tuin" (D),
"leek-town" *s*. De Vries says that "look" (ranging from allium to garlic to
chives) was held in high regard, according to old Norwegian runes.

Kind greetings,

Luc Hellinckx

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From: Wim <wkv at home.nl>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (12) [D/E]

From: wk at home.nl  wim verdoold, zwolle  nl

Hoi allemaal,

over gaarrde, tuin , hof   wat me te binnen schiet, ik zag dat russisch
genoemd werd...het  russische woord voor  stad is....Grad...   en dat
sluit weer aan bij gaarde.
En het noorse woord voor boerderij?  Ik zag in noorwegen vaak bordjes
met gardstun staan als de weg langs een boerderij liep.

Tuin zaun town, tüün, tuin, en in het ijslands, bestaat het woord ook
weer.

Hartelijke groeten uit Zwolle,

Wim.

http://members.home.nl/wkv/index.html

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From: denis dujardin <dujardin at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (12) [D/E]

About "gard". We cannot forget metionning the famous traditional Swedsih
fence called the "Gärdsgard", sounding like a pleonasm (guarding the
garden.......).
See it at  www.abo.fi/~mabjork/ bakgrundsbilder.htm    for its newer version
and on     www.roslagen.nu/ handelser.html    for its more older traditional
form.

Denis Dujardin
West-Flanders.

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From: Markus Haverkamp <mjhaverkamp at yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.07.28 (05) [E]


"yard" seems to be a dialect varient of "garden". These words are, however,
not of the same root as "ward" and "guard". Of the latter two words, the
former is of German origin, whereas the latter is a formerly French
loan-word that was brought into the English language through the Normans.

Markus

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From: R. F. Hahn <lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net>
Subject: Etymology

Folks,

As you can see, a lot of etymologizing action greeted me this morning as I
was opening my mailbox.  It's so nice to hear some of the more rarely heard
voices!  (Dag, Liza! Tere, Mari!)

And a special _Willkamen_ and _Moin_ to you, Markus, a new subscriber!
Great to see you participating already (and doing everything correctly,
including not leaving out the subject ...).

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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