LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.03.26 (04) [E]

Fri Mar 26 23:02:21 UTC 2004

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L O W L A N D S - L * 26.MAR.2004 (04) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Mathieu van Woerkom <mathieu at brabants.org>
Subject: Language varieties

In addition to our discussion last week about language varieties around the
Dutch-German border, and the classification of these language varieties,
take a look at this page (about Limburgish, only available in Dutch):

http://taal.phileon.nl/lim_rijnlands.php

regards,
Mathieu

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From: Roger Hondshoven <roger.hondshoven at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.03.26 (03) [E]

Hello Roger T,

Dietsche Warande is indisputably a respectable magazine founded in 1855. But
"Diets" is only a part of a title. It does by no means imply that it is a
word currently used in present-day spoken language. It certainl is not.
Please also see my reply to Elsie's message.

Regards

Roger H

Hello Elsie,

Thank you for your reaction. I am fully aware that "Diets" lies at the
origin of language names such as Duits, Deutsch, Nederduits, Plattdiets and
Dutch. The meaning originally was Germanic and (in a more restrictive sense)
the idiom spoken in te Lowlands. But today it is mainly used as an
historical term. The word has been practically extinct since approximately
the 17th century.  Only in the latter half of the 19th and in the first
decades of the 20th centuries was it reintroduced in Flemish circles
promoting the use of the vernacular in the Northern part of Belgium. It was
used both in Flanders and in the Netherlands by the Groot Nederlandse
beweging, a movement striving for the reunion of Flanders and the
Netherlands.  It became a favourite in the national-socialist vocabulary in
the thirties and during the 2nd World War. You will appreciate that it was
seen as a symbol of the collaboration with the Germans and that as such it
was scorned by the large majority of the population. After the war it was
completely discredited. No amount of nostalgia will bring it back to life.

Kind regards

Roger H.

-------Original Message-------

From: lowlands-l at LOWLANDS-L.NET
Date: Friday, March 26, 2004 18:48:32
To: LOWLANDS-L at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.03.26 (03) [E]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 26.MAR.2004 (03) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
http://www.lowlands-l.net * lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Rules & Guidelines: http://www.lowlands-l.net/index.php?page=rules
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Encoding: Unicode (UTF-8) [Please switch your view mode to it.]
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=======================================================================
A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
=======================================================================

From: Mathieu van Woerkom <mathieu at brabants.org>
Subject: Language varieties

In addition to our discussion last week about language varieties around the
Dutch-German border, and the classification of these language varieties,
take a look at this page (about Limburgish, only available in Dutch):

http://taal.phileon.nl/lim_rijnlands.php

regards,
Mathieu

----------

From: Roger Hondshoven <roger.hondshoven at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.03.26 (03) [E]

Hello Roger T,

Dietsche Warande is indisputably a respectable magazine founded in 1855. But
"Diets" is only a part of a title. It does by no means imply that it is a
word currently used in present-day spoken language. It certainl is not.
Please also see my reply to Elsie's message.

Regards

Roger H

Hello Elsie,

Thank you for your reaction. I am fully aware that "Diets" lies at the
origin of language names such as Duits, Deutsch, Nederduits, Plattdiets and
Dutch. The meaning originally was Germanic and (in a more restrictive sense)
the idiom spoken in te Lowlands. But today it is mainly used as an
historical term. The word has been practically extinct since approximately
the 17th century.  Only in the latter half of the 19th and in the first
decades of the 20th centuries was it reintroduced in Flemish circles
promoting the use of the vernacular in the Northern part of Belgium. It was
used both in Flanders and in the Netherlands by the Groot Nederlandse
beweging, a movement striving for the reunion of Flanders and the
Netherlands.  It became a favourite in the national-socialist vocabulary in
the thirties and during the 2nd World War. You will appreciate that it was
seen as a symbol of the collaboration with the Germans and that as such it
was scorned by the large majority of the population. After the war it was
completely discredited. No amount of nostalgia will bring it back to life.

Kind regards

Roger H.

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