LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.09.03 (08) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 03.SEP.2004 (08) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Sandy Fleming <sandy at scotstext.org>
Subject: "Language varieties" [E]

> From: Ingmar Roerdinkholder <ingmar.roerdinkholder at worldonline.nl>
> Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.09.02 (09) [E/Middelsprake]
>
> Good idea, Mike! Many members of this list will be compotent in more than
> one Germanic language or at least know a lot about linguistics etc. But
for
> me it won't be easy to find a monolingual to test Middelsprake on, because
> my compatriots all know Dutch (and often a Dutch dialect) but nearly all
are
> more or less competent in the two big GermLangs. Even my 85 year old
> grandmom, whose first language is Lower Saxon, second lang Dutch, but she
> knows quite a lot of English and High German as well. I think in countries
> like Germany or the UK it's much easier to find monolingual speakers

I don't know much of the Germanic languages off this island (ie, I do know
Scots and English very well but not the other languages) and I do find I get
stuck with Middelsprake sometimes, eg:

> Ig wil make mi self kenned an ju:

Not sure what the "an" is - unless guessing from the context it must be
"to".

> miin name is Ingmar Roerdinkholder, ig kom fra Nederland on ha mennig

"on ha mennig"? - no idea on the first reading, but having familiarised
myself more I realise it must be "I have many".

> Miin modersprake is Nederlandisch, miin moderdialekt Nedersaksisch doch ig

"doch"?

And so on. I'm not sure about the use of words like "under", "over" and "on"
which seem to be false friends with common English words and might cause
confusion to English monolinguals. I think it might be better in such cases
to borrow the English word, which would hopefully be unambiguous to all.

I'm sure I could quickly learn to understand Middelsprake, but only because
I have dabbled in German, Dutch, Frisian, Swedish and Icelandic at times,
and with words like "kenned" even Scots helps. I'm not so sure that English
monolinguals would find it so easy.

Sandy
http://scotstext.org/

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch-l at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language varieties

Sandy:

> > Miin modersprake is Nederlandisch, miin moderdialekt Nedersaksisch doch
ig
>
> "doch"?

Related to "though," here meaning "but."

This is where the non-Continental varieties are sort of left out of the loop
here.  The results of the shift th > d, for instance, are not obvious to
most of them, unless they are versed in other Germanic varieties and can see
the connections.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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