LL-L "Delectables" 2005.05.13 (03) [E/S]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 13.MAY.2005 (03) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: Tom Mc Rae <t.mcrae at uq.net.au>
Subject: LL-L "Delectables" 2005.05.12 (07) [E]


On 13/05/2005, at 7:33 AM, Sandy Fleming <sandy at scotstext.org> wrote:


  From:

  Subject: "Delectables" [E]




  That sounds strange to me. At least, beef suet is great for suet dumplings

  as an accompaniment to that classic Scottish dish, "Mince and tatties"!

Aye Sandy right herrt attack fare that loat. Nae wunder the Scoats hae such
a loat o' herrt trubbles.
Ah cannae stand munth an' tatties onywey, in Edinburgh in the 40's-50's they
selt munth roalls in cafes, cauld stuff oan a bap grease an aw.
Daft gowks luved thum tae.


Regards

Tom Mc Rae

Brisbane Australia

Oh Wad Some Power the Giftie Gie Us

Tae See Oorsel's as Ithers See Us

Robert Burns


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From: Thomas Byro <greenherring at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Delectables" 2005.05.12 (07) [E]

Sandy

Talc on bread IS utterly disgusting.  Fortunately it did not make a
frequent appearance.  Once is enough though.

This thread though makes me wonder about the origin of apple pie as is
found here in the USA, a pastry top and bottom filled with apple.  In
the lowlands my mother used to bake something (I forgot what it was
called) with a pastry bottom only and apples on top.  I ate my first
apple pie at the house of a friend whose family came from Bayern.  He
thought I was crazy when I told him that I had never eaten a pie
before.  He said that his entire family in Bayern baked them.

Tom Byro

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Delectables

As far as this _tal(li)g_ / _Talg_ (tallow, suet) on bread thing goes, an
old-timer recently confirmed that it did occur and that, no, it was not lard
or drippings, though these were eaten too, were considered treats,
comparatively speaking ...  But this goes back to the end and the aftermath
of World War II.  I'm sure people were happy to even get their hands on suet
at that time, going by all the horror stories I used to be fed each night
after dinner when I was very young.  People ate unspeakable things at that
time, just to make it to the next day.  Our friends in and from the
Netherlands may have heard similar stories from their elders, and some of
our Lowlanders may have even lived though it themselves.  It is only from
older people in China and from friends and acquaintances that survived
"life" in the Warsaw Ghetto and Auschwitz that I have been told food stories
that top the ones my parents told us.

On the brighter side ... turning to our two Toms above ...

Tom Mac Rae:

> in Edinburgh in the 40's-50's they selt munth roalls in cafes,
> cauld stuff oan a bap grease an aw.

I had the pleisur o preein a pickle o thae in the mid-60s, in cafés an aw.
It was awfi scunnersome, waur cauld, weel-a-whit.

Tom Byro:

> He
> thought I was crazy when I told him that I had never eaten a pie
> before.

I never tasted or saw any pie in Northern Germany either, saw the first ones
in England as a teenager.  Before that we were told that "hoity-toity
gourmets" in certain countries, especially in France, eat a lot of pastries
(_Pasteten_), usually savory ones, and all of that was exotic to us.  Was it
similar in the Netherlands, or was French influence via Belgium stronger
there?

Since our home cuisine was a mixture of Lowlands and Slavonic cuisines, in
both of which dishes made from fruit are a big deal (including fruit soups),
I conclude that we lived too far east and north for the pie thing to have
reached.  The closest thing may have been the famous apple cake my mother
made, a recipe passed down from the east (an apples-and-raisins layer
between two layers of cake dough).  I understand that pies are now known and
made throughout Germany due to the influences of traveling and the media,
and that they are called by their English names.

South Germans have always had  closer contacts with French culture via the
German-speaking parts of France, and also via Switzerland.  So it does not
surprise me that they adopted pastries of that sort earlier.  Not even the
Napoleonic occupation of Northern Germany seems to have had much of a
cultural or culinary impact.  Perhaps this is due to its relative brevity,
the scarcity of French civilians, and widespread resentment of the
occupiers' behavior, including such things as using Protestant churches as
horse stables.

I also wonder if this is due to North Germans being traditionally more
_kruysch_, i.e., "picky," afraid of tasting new foods.  (_Wat de buer nich
kent, dat vrit hey nich_ "The peasant won't eat what he doesn't know.")  I
know this sounds really stereotypical, and these days it is overly
stereotypical, but I found it to be very widespread in Northern Germany and
also in the Netherlands when I was a kid.  Well, I noticed it while
traveling, observing that people in other places were *not* like that,
except that I noticed a fair bit of it in Britain in the 1960s and 1970s.  I
wonder if this is an old Lowlands trait, areas like today's Belgium being
abherrant due to French influences.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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