LL-L 'Phonology' 2006.06.26 (01 [E]

Mon Jun 26 17:28:57 UTC 2006

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L O W L A N D S - L * 26 June 2006 * Volume 01
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From: Henno Brandsma <hennobrandsma at hetnet.nl>
Subject: LL-L 'Phonology' 2006.06.26 (08] [E]

> From: 'Stellingwerfs Eigen' <info at stellingwerfs-eigen.nl
> Subject: LL-L 'Phonology'
>
> Henno wrote:
>> And further broken to "jin" and "ien" [jIn] as well. Here "jin" is
>> the objective form of "one" as an indefinite pronoun (belonging to
>> "men"
> [m at n] as
>> the subjective form):
>> "men moat jin altyd waskje" (one always has to wash oneself), and as
>> an cardinal it is broken in
>> compounds: "ienentweintich" ([jIn at ntwaint@x].
>
> Additional to that _jin_ in 'ienentweintig' sometimes we use
> 'jitres' (Nl.
> eens, Ã©Ã©nmaal; E. once, one time).

"jitris" means "one more time", not just "one time" (at least to me).
This has nothing to do with "jin" but with "jit" which has the same
origin as "yet" in English.
"jit" is now an obsolete word in West Frisian ("noch" is just now).
Of course "ris" comes from "*re:s", cf Dutch "reis" (older Dutch 'nog
een reis' = nog eens, nog een keer).

Henno

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From: Henno Brandsma <hennobrandsma at hetnet.nl>
Subject: LL-L 'Phonology' 2006.06.26 (08] [E]

> From: 'Tom Carty' <cartyweb at hotmail.com>
> Subject: LL-L 'Sports' 2006.06.26 (06] [E]
>
> n Irish, one is aon (pron ay-eoin)
>
> Its similar in Scots and Manx Gaelic.
>
> I think it comes from Latin, hence the similarity with Germanic
> words for
> one.

I don't think it comes from Latin, but it is cognate to the Latin
"unum", as are the Germanic equivalents "one", "ien", "een", "ein(s)".
We're all one big family (Indo-Eureopean) so these similarities are
pretty common.....

Regards,

Henno

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From: Dan Prohaska <danielprohaska at bluewin.ch>
Subject: Phonology

I've just noticed a couple of typos in my previous message, as well as two
example words that seem to have got lost on the way.

Corrected version below:

----------

From: Dan Prohaska <danielprohaska at bluewin.ch>
Subject: Phonology

Reinhard,
As far as I know, breaking of ME /O:/, initial and following /h/, was a
fairly regular feature of West and North-West Midlands speech. A further
example which comes to mind is the Lancashire pronunciation of as
[wOm].

Note, also, that in the area where this breaking originates the vowel isn't
/V/ as in RP, but /O/.

I should think that the distinction may have been imported into Standard
English as a practical dissimilation of homophones like and
which would both have been /o:n/.

Dan

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Phonology 

Hi again, Dan!  It's been great hearing from you again, by the way.

I suppose Southern English would have had something like *[oUn] had the
development of Old English _Än_/_Ã¡n_ ~ _Ån_ 'one' be regular, as in OE _stÃ¡n_
*[stQ:n] > MidE _stoon_ *[sto:n] > "stone" [stoUn] (cf. Scots [ste:n]) and OE
_bÃ¡n_ *[bQ:n] > MidE _boon_ *[bo:n] > "bone" [boUn] (cf. Scots [be:n]).  (Cf. OF
_stÃªn_ > _stÃªn_ ~ _stien_, _bÃªn_; OS _stÃªn_ > [stE.In] ~ [sta.In]; OLF _stÃªn_ >
Dutch _steen_ [ste:n] ~ [steIn].)

This hypothetical Modern *[oUn] 'one' would have coincided with [oUn] (< MidE
_au(e)n_ < OE _aÆ½en_ ~ _agen_) "own" (cf. Scots _ain_ [e:n]; OS _Ä“gan_ > MidS
_Ä“gen_ > MLS ["E.Ig=N] ~ ["a.Ig=N]).

By the way, lets also mention that Afrikaans has been undergoing the beginnings
of "vowel breaking" as well, namely of the long mid-level vowels [e:] and [o:]. 
So I hear written _steen_ 'stone' as [stIE~(n)], [stI@~(n)], [stie~(n)],
[sti@~(n)] etc., and written _groot_ 'great' as [xrUOt] and [xruot].  In rapid
speech they (almost) sound like [stje~(n)] and [xrwo] respectively.  So we might
be able to observe "breaking in the making" there.

What I also find particularly interesting is that Australian and New Zealand
English (also a few England English dialects, including Cockney) has been
developing high monophthongs into rising diphthongs, something like /ii/ -> [Ii]
~ [@I] and /uu/ -> [7M]; cf. "deed" [dIid] ~ [d at Id], "soon" [s7Mn], with (slight)
labializtion after labials; e.g., "bee" [b(w)Ii] ~ [b(w)@I], "pool" [p(w)7ML]. 
(These phonetics are in SAMPA script:
http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/sampa/ipasam-x.pdf)  I believe that this is
similar to what in Late Middle English or Early Modern English happened to old
/ii/ and /uu/.  So you might argue that this is a "second round" of the same in
the mentioned dialects; e.g.; MidE _tid(e)_ ~ _tyd(e)_ *[ti:d(@)] > *[tVId(@)] >
ModE "tide" [taId]; MidE _hous_ *[hu:z] > *[hVUz] > ModE "house" [haUz].

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

P.S.: Sorry I was ahead by a day yesterday, folks.  To many things to do under
too much pressure and stress and in too much heat.  We're expected to have
temperatures in the 90s F (well over 30 C) range today, hotter than in California ...

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