LL-L "Language diversity" 2009.02.21 (01) [E]

[Lowlands-L List]

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L O W L A N D S - L - 21 February 2009 - Volume 01
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From: Wesley Parish <wes.parish at paradise.net.nz>
Subject: LL-L "Language diversity" 2009.02.20 (01) [E/LS]

On Saturday 21 February 2009 04:33, Lowlands-L List wrote:
<snip>
> ----------
>
> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Language diversity
>
> Leve Hanne, ik heff dien Œversetten an Arjen wiederstüürt. Wääs' bedankt.
>
> Nice poems, Wes! Suggestion: pick one, and not the longest one. That way
> you may actually get responses, o Evil One.
>
> By the way, I'm intrigued by the "masalai" part in the URLs. In Tok Pisin
> it means something like 'monster' or 'bogeyman'
> (http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/tokpisin.php).

True.  I have actually been threatened as a kid:
Bai masalai i kaikaiim yu, sapos yu go insait long bus!
The masalai'll eat you if you go into the bush!

That day I was running up a hill to my home, and the speaker didn't like
it. ;)
>
> Regards,
> Reinhard/Ron

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From: Luc Hellinckx <luc.hellinckx at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language diversity"

 Beste Marcus,



You wrote:



It's true that Englishmen didn't kill Welsh people and there were no
obvious orders to "kill Welsh language/culture" and the English indeed
were able to indoctrinate Welsh people to participate in their
English-only system. There was no big anti-Welsh plot. And still I say,
yes, the English tried to eliminate the Welsh language and culture.
Cause they took many measures to support and protect English, but they
took no measures to support or protect Welsh. They didn't try to kill
the language but they were fully aware, that the way they were acting
could and would lead to the extinction of Welsh in the long run. And
they were very fine with that.



I completely agree with everything you write, but this can also be applied
to minorities within Wales.



There have been sizeable communities of Flemish weavers migrating to Wales
during the Middle Ages. Do you think any Welshman ever tried to support or
protect Flemish culture or language in Wales? Don't think so, but please
correct me if I'm wrong. If ever, something Flemish survived in Wales, I
think it is mainly the result of self support.

On the other hand, it's true that this situation cannot be fully compared
with the treatment of Wales by the English, since the Flemish were migrating
to Wales, and the Welsh were there "first". However, I do not like to use
the argument "first", as a pretext for having more rights (and duties).



Kind greetings,



Luc Hellinckx


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From: James Wilson <jawi2300 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: LL-L "Language diversity" 2009.02.20 (05) [E]

 Hi Paul & Heather,

Paul wrote:
'I believe much of the problem with the languages and dialects of England
and Wales is that the speakers refuse to be bilingual.'

Sorry Paul but I am going to use Heathers 'GRRRR..'.  Any dialect in the UK
has been viewed as lazy, working class, poor English, etc, etc.  They have
only ever been studied as dialects of English by anyone outside.  The
Northumbrian Language Society (within the area) views it differently.  Also,
as a child, I had to leave my dialect/language '...at the school gate'; as
it was viewed as something inferior to that which I will be taught, not only
English, but French, German, Latin/Classical Greek!  I have never been
bilingual in Northumbrian and English because of the reasons given here.

I do not believe that I have ever given the impression that others
*should *learn
Northumbrian.  I also fully understand the uselessness of my Northumbrian
Geordie; not only south of the Tees river but also in the rest of the world
(I have lived in Denmark for 22 years)

As to the reference of Geordie violence; I have two boys (they are Danish)
who try to imitate my Geordie and I certainly do not beat them for doing so
(as my English master did so often to those young Geordies who dared venture
from the path of righteousness ;)

Regards

James
Copenhagen

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From: Mike Morgan <mwmosaka at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: LL-L "Language diversity" 2009.02.20 (05) [E]

 Heather,

Heather wrote:,

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

I do get so angry when people promulgate this anti-British (?English)
nonsense.

You MIGHT want to read the opening sections of the Acts of Union, which make
fairly CLEAR what the English (Henry may have had Welsh blood, but he was
fairly Saesneg in every other part of his body! and the Acts were the work
of the ENGLISH government) envisioned for the Welsh language "sinister
usages and customs" ...



It can be read at:

http://books.google.com/books?id=n_vUx1TtH5AC&pg=PA328&lpg=PA328&dq=acts+of+union+all+and+singular+sinister+usages+and+customs&source=bl&ots=nSTPhBFnZT&sig=0reAw3UO-G8wBd5svtrhb04rHDY&hl=en&ei=svufSej9MIbAkAXy4_DmCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=2&ct=result



U C > || mwm
================
Dr Michael W Morgan
Ishara Foundation || ईशारा फॉउंडेशन  || イシャラ基金
Mumbai/Bombay *|* मुंबई *|* ムンバイ/ボンベイ (インド)
www.ishara.org
+++++++++++++++
"People interested only in the bottom line, seem to have forgotten that the
stars are in the oposite direction" (anon)
-------
Цхьана буйна ши хорбаз тарлур яц.  = Ee kinnae haud twa wattermelon wi ae
niv.

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From: heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk <heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: LL-L "Language diversity" 2009.02.20 (07) [E]

from Heather Rendall heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk

Correction

When I said that there was no directive from above to 'kill' the Welsh
language, I was thinking about the 19th century and clean forgot about
earlier directives of exactly that nature - issued by................ the
Tudors, our only Welsh royal family. Was it Henry VIII or Elizabeth who
banned the Eisteddford? And I believe Elizabeth was particularly paranoid
about languages other than English being used - because she wouldn't be able
to know whether they were plotting against her or not????

Ironic or what?

Heather

•

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