LL-L "Literature" 2011.08.03 (04) [EN]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L - 03 August 2011 - Volume 04
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From: list at marcusbuck.org
Subject: LL-L "Literature" 2011.08.02 (05) [EN]

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>

> Subject: Literature
>
> Dear Lowlanders,
>
> I believe it is fair to assume that the Germanic sagas existed as oral
> literature well before they came to be recorded in writing. Once in a while
> local variants of some of them are discovered (not counting modern
> translations), few of them far afield.
>
> All the more remarkable does it seem that a variant of the Krimhild Saga
> has
> been discovered as an alleged national epic of the Chuvash people. This is
> outlined in the *Eurasisches Magazin* review of the book *Attil und
> Krimkilte: Das tschuwaschische Epos zum Sagenkreis der
> Nibelungen*(translated from Russian):
>
> http://www.eurasischesmagazin.de/artikel/?artikelID=20110819
>
> Remarkably, it features not only Krimhild (~ Gudrun) but also the Hunnic
> leader Attila. Indeed, some consider the character of Attila's wife Hildico
> (Ildiko) to at least have influenced the Krimhild character. A shared
> Eurasian theme? Where did it start? In the east or in the west? Did the
> Goths have a hand in its spread?
>
> The Chuvash people (Чăвашсем) are usually referred to as "Turkic," though
> their Chuvash language (Чӑвашла) derived from Old Bolghar, which some
> consider a close relative of Proto-Turkic. (It is of great importance to
> historical Turkic and more general Altaic linguistics.) Today, most Chuvash
> live in the Chuvash Republic (Чăваш Республики, Чăваш Ен) within the
> Russian
> Federation, and most of them are Russian Orthodox Christians.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuvash_people
>

Sounds very interesting. A bit _too_ interesting. If I understand it
correctly the Chuvash call the main characters "Attil" and "Krimhilte". This
sounds amazingly close to the names in the Western tradition. Attila died in
the year 453. If it's indeed a separate line of transmission you would
expect more change in 1500 years than a single letter. If you look at the
amount of variation in the Western traditions (which always were in contact)
you would expect severe alterations in a completely separate strain of
transmission.

To me the only plausible explanation is that a written account of the
Western version of the Nibelungs was translated into Russian and it entered
Chuvash oral tradition when a Chuvash told the story he had read in a book
to his fellow Chuvashs.

And I also find it odd that if they discovered the connection in 1992, why
is a 2011 book the first time this is covered? I tried to google some of the
keywords and it's all related to the book now published.

Marcus Buck

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From: heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk
Subject: LL-L "Literature" 2011.08.02 (05) [EN]

from heather Rendall <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Hahn>
heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk

re variants of old legends / epics

In Legends of the Severn Valley - stories collected by Alfred
Rowberry Williams there is a story called " In Gloster Forest"  which
tells of a hill outside Gloucester shaded by a grove where hunstmaen
tired from the chase could enter one at a time. In the middle of the
grove the hunter had to call out "I thirst" for a young man to appear
offering a large and beautifully decorated drinking horn. The hunter
had to take the horn and drink till satisfied. Whereupon he felt
rejuvenated and ready for the rest of the chase One condition was that
he must not speak to the attendant, who disappeared as soon as the
hunter had finished drinking

Surely hidden in here is a remnant of Bran's Horn one of the 13 magic
items of Britain, which, rather like the more general cornu copia,
refreshed all at the banquet as it passed by filling each horn or
goblet with whatsoever each man chose to drink ( Rhydderch's platter
doing the same thing at the same time but for food rather than drink.)
The silent attendant or being served magically was also part of the
Visit to the Castle of Arianhod - a faint echo of which still resonates
in Beauty and the Beast where the merchant is served by unseen hands to
all he wishes to eat and drink until refreshed.

Heather
Worcester UK
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