Kozak/Cossack language, 2

[Edward M Dumanis]

Dear Dr. Onujec and all others,

I have not questioned the proposed genealogy.
The irony was directed only at the way of establishing a support for the 
genealogy through the reference on the language used by performers.
I just immediately recalled that the Chorus of the Moscow State 
Conservatory won a Choral competition in Finland about 20 years ago 
singing in Finnish some Finnish folk songs.
However, if the proposed genealogy cannot be supported by such a 
reference, it does not mean that it is false. It follows only that
other means should be used to establish it. That's all.

Sincerely,

Edward Dumanis <dumanis at buffalo.edu>

On Wed, 10 Dec 2008, ionujec at COMCAST.NET wrote:

> To Professor Edward M Dumanis:
>
> Logic by analogy and irony ("So far, I have not heard any claims on the Finnish origin of
> Muscovites.") - is not logic by genealogy and history!
>
> Pomerantz, a talented soviet semiotician, bequeathed us a generous and, I would say, unwittingly self-sacrificial or  cynical testimony (1953, Kuban') about the Russification and de-Ukrainianization of the Kuban' Ukrainians. 1953 - is very recent under any theory or irony, but one must notice: russification came after the decimation of the Kuban' Ukrainians by famine in 1933! No wonder: Ukrainian memory and nationalism are alive in Kuban' even today - as recounted by Natalia!
>
> Thus from Pomerantz:
>
> Ð’ 1953 году я начал работать учителем в станице Шкуринской (бывшего кубанского казачьего войска), и вот оказалось, что некоторые школьники 8-го класса не говорят по-русски. Мне отвечали по учебнику наизусть. Кубанцы — потомки запорожцев, их родной язык — украинский, но за семь лет можно было чему-то выучиться... Я решил обойти родителей наиболее косноязычных учеников и посоветовать им следить за чтением детей. Начал случайно с девочки, у которой была русская фамилия. Допустим, Горкина. Мать ответила мне на нелитературном, с какими-то областÐ
> ½Ñ‹Ð¼Ð
> ¸ чертами, но бесспорно русском языке. С явным удовольствием ответила, с улыбкой. “Так вы русская?” — “Да, мы из-под Воронежа. Нас переселили в 1933 году вместо вымерших с голоду”. — “Отчего же не выучили дочку своему родному языку?” — “Что вы, ей проходу не было! Били смертным боем!”
> Оказалось, что мальчишки лет пяти, дошкольники, своими крошечными кулачками заставили детей переселенцев балакать по-местному. В школе это продолжалось. За каждое русское слово на перемене — по зубам. По-русски только на уроке, учителю. Запрет снимался с 8-го класса. Ученики старших классов — отрезанный ломоть, они собирались в город, учиться, и им надо говорить на языке города. Действительно, к 10-му классу мои казачата уже сносно разговаривали. Вся эта автономистская языковая политика стойко продержалась с 1933-го (когда была отменена укр
> аин
> изация) до 1953-го и продолжалась при мне, то есть до 1956-го. Дальше не знаю.
> Я не думаю, что сопротивление было сознательно организовано взрослыми. Организацию выбили бы в 1936–1939 годах или в 1944-м, во время ликвидации неблагонадежных, сотрудничавших с немцами. Нет, никакой организации не было. Было казачье самосознание, которое дети чувствовали, — и детская самодеятельность. Дети сохранили господство украинского языка в кубанских станицах; дети же сохранили традиции травли евреев — там, где были евреи (в станице единственным евреем был я)...
>
>
>
> Григорий Померанц
> Догматы полемики и этнический мир
> http://magazines.russ.ru/zvezda/2003/6/pomer.html
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Ioan Onujec, PhD
>
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: Edward M Dumanis <dumanis at BUFFALO.EDU>
>> I'd like to thank Natalia Pylypiuk for her very interesting presentation.
>> However, I have a problem with the last argument.
>> I know that a Moscow Conservatory chorus sang in Finnish while performing
>> in Finland. So far, I have not heard any claims on the Finnish origin of
>> Muscovites.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> Edward Dumanis <dumanis at buffalo.edu>
>>
>> On Tue, 9 Dec 2008, Natalia Pylypiuk wrote:
>>
>>> (cont.)
>>>
>>> (3) The kozak Samiilo Velychko (1620-1728), who worked in the chancellery of
>>> Vasyl' Kochubei, left us a monumental, three volume chronicle, titled
>>> "Skazaniie o voini kosatskoi z poliakamy, cherez Zinovia Bohdana
>>> Khmelnytskoho ... v osmi litekh tochyvshaiasia,"
>>> This work is a critical response to the versified narrative, Wojna domowa z
>>> Kozaki i Tatary,  by the Polish writer Samuel Twardowski, and various other
>>> Kozak chronicles.  For a glimpse into Velychko's language, visit:
>>> <http://litopys.org.ua/old18/old18_33.htm>
>>> In the introduction to the second volume, which is not available on the
>>> internet, Velychko refers to his country as Ukraina-Malorosiiska or Kozatska
>>> Ukraina, and sometimes uses the modifiers Kozako-Ukrainska Malorosiiska.  He
>>> also refers to his people as "narod nash Kozako Ruskii."  Velychko's language
>>> differs somewhat from the Ruthenian spoken in mid-seventeenth century. It
>>> reflects the dialect of left-bank Ukraine after more than fifty years of its
>>> severance from the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth.  On aspects of this
>>> chronicle, see Marko Pavlyshyn, "Writings in Ukraine and European Identity,"
>>> Themes and Variations in Slavic Languages and Cultures, ed. by David N. Wells
>>> (2008) pp. 1-22
>>> < http://www.cerc.unimelb.edu.au/anzsa/MSK%20volume.pdf>
>>>
>>> I can cite countless other examples of writings by and for the Kozaky /
>>> Cossacks of Ukraine.  Instead, I will refer you to:
>>> Serhii Plokhy, The Cossacks and Religion in Early Modern Ukraine (Oxford
>>> University Press, 2001),
>>> Frank Sysyn, "Recovering the Ancient and Recent Past: The Shaping of Memory
>>> and Identity in Early Modern Ukraine,"
>>> Eighteenth-Century Studies - Volume 35, Number 1, Fall 2001, pp. 77-84
>>>
>>> Plokhy's book and Sysyn's article are not devoted to language issues, but do
>>> shed considerable light on the culture of Kozaky / Cossacks.
>>>
>>> I will leave 19th c. texts for another discussion.
>>>
>>> Now let me cite something I witnessed in the winter of 1990, when I was
>>> conducting research in Kyiv.  An ensemble of Kuban' Kozaky / Cossacks was on
>>> tour, and performed at the prestigious Polytechnical Institute.  The
>>> auditorium was completely full. Most of the songs they sang were in
>>> Ukrainian, albeit slightly Russified.  Among the songs they sang, there was
>>> one about hetman Doroshenko (1621).  And, much to my surprise, they concluded
>>> the concert by singing the national anthem of Ukraine, "Shche ne vmerla
>>> Ukra�na."  The audience stood up and sang with them.  This was before
>>> Ukraine's declaration of independence.
>>>
>>> Since then, ensembles from the Kuban' have regularly attended the annual folk
>>> festivals that take place in Ukraine.  However, in the summer of 2008, the
>>> Russian government forbade all performers from the Kuban'  to travel abroad.
>>> Thus, there were no "kubans'ki kozaky" at the Rivne festival.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Natalia Pylypiuk
>>> (University of Alberta)
>>>
>>> p.s. I will return to the Volodymyr / Vladimir thread after correcting exams.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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