Proverb

[Gasan Gusejnov]

Dear Lily,

I wouldn't say 'exactly the opposite': there is just a tiny shift of meaning
in both words:
brave (bold) -> audacious
Fortuna -> luckiness,
which altogether provides just a sort of descension (not even mockery) of
the original meaning.

Кто смел, тот и съел is a slightly more positive expression of the same
concept.

In the proverb "наглость второе счастье" наглость is not direct, but
mediated and thus smoothed with the framework of a proverb as a whole.

All the best,
Gasan Gusejnov


2008/5/16 Lily Alexander <lily.alexander at utoronto.ca>:

> Dear Robert and Colleagues,
>
> I think your translation means exactly the opposite. :-)
> What's wrong with being brave and hence being lucky? There is no
> contradiction, while the Russian proverb stresses one.
> (Of course the difference has cultural connotations and implications).
>
> Naglost in Russian is a very bad thing. It is essentially a form of robbery
> and action based on a sense of entitlement - taking by force what does not
> belong to one and taking it from many truly deserving.
> Stalin for example was naglyi, not bold (Some may disagree).
>
> The proverb is very bitter rather than inspirational, which happens with
> the Russian proverbs. Perhaps the translation should reflect its paradoxical
> nature and this profound disappointment with the state of the world.
>
> Impudent? Egregious? Arrogant? Cheeky? Insolent? Copper-faced?
>
> This is what Multitran gives for 'naglyi':
>
>
>>        impudent <http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=36005_1_2>; insolent <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=36006_1_2>; audacious <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=46115_1_2>; assured <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=52120_1_2>; bold <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=57735_1_2>; as bold as brass <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=57743_1_2>; bold-faced <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=57746_1_2>; brazen <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=67976_1_2>; brash <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=109761_1_2>; immodest <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=140397_1_2>; impertinent <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=140584_1_2>; perky <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=157743_1_2>; unashamed <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=186566_1_2>; unblushing <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=186626_1_2>; uppish <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=187644_1_2>; uppity <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=187647_1_2>; bareknuckle <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=641261_1_2>; brazen-faced <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=644886_1_2>; hubristic <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=679230_1_2>; lippy <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=687881_1_2>; unbashful <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=732857_1_2>; arrogant <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=745657_1_2>; bumptious <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=751391_1_2>; cheeky <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=754031_1_2>; pert <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=787546_1_2>; snotty <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=801183_1_2>; brassy <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=2105457_1_2>; bauld <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=3950644_1_2>; brassbound <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=3951871_1_2>; nervy <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=3972401_1_2>; blatant <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?t=4171669_1_2> (ложь lie /Andrew Goff/ <
>> http://www.multitran.ru/c/m.exe?a=ShowUserInformation&UserName=Andrew%20Goff>)
>>
>>
>>  Best regards,
>
> Lily Alexander
>
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