'Have you eaten?' and 'Did you eat?'

[Lyudmila Grinshpan]

Не совсем.
Луна спряталась за облака - The Moon hid
behind the clouds... or The Moon has hidden behind the clouds ... or The Moon had hidden behind the clouds (Уже спряталась — действие закончено, луны не видно) 
Луна пряталась за облаками - The
Moon was hiding behind the clouds... (пряталась в течение какого-то времени)

--- On Wed, 9/10/08, Alex <a_strat at HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:

From: Alex <a_strat at HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 'Have you eaten?' and 'Did you eat?'
To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU
Date: Wednesday, September 10, 2008, 8:39 AM

Codepage = KOI8-R

Hello!

Did I understand it correct, that for the "Past (or Present) Perfect"
in
Russian we should use SIMPLE PAST in English and vice versa?

For example: Луна спряталась за облака - The Moon hid
behind the clouds...
              but: Луна пряталась за облака(ми) - The
Moon has hidden behind
the clouds...

is that it?

Alex S (Дядя Саша)

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Langran" <john at RUSLAN.CO.UK>
To: <SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU>
Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 3:50 PM
Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 'Have you eaten?' and 'Did you eat?'


> This reminds me of a mistake that I made once on arriving home at
friends'
> flat in Moscow quite late, when they had already started eating.
>
> I wanted to know if they had had any soup. I asked "Vy c'yeli
sup?"
> They thought I was asking whether they had eaten it all up and left none
for
> me.
> Perfective = completion.
> Of course I should have asked "Vy yeli sup?"
> I have used this as an aspect example ever since.
>
> John Langran
> www.ruslan.co.uk
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <pscotto at MTHOLYOKE.EDU>
> To: <SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2008 1:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 'Have you eaten?' and 'Did you
eat?'
>
>
> > Just quickly: I have often found it helpful to think of the
perfective
as
> > embedded in an implicit narrative sequence. "[So then] I called
home."
> >
> > Peter Scotto
> > Mount Holyoke College
> >
> > Quoting Ralph Cleminson <Ralph.Cleminson at PORT.AC.UK>:
> >
> >> In the abstract, I would be inclined to agree: ?? ??????? ??????
= Did
> >> you phone home [ever]?, but ?? ????????? ?????? = Have you phoned
home
> >> [just now]?  However, this is one of those occasions when it all
depends
> >> on context.  If one is speaking about a specific occasion in the
past,
> >> then ?? ????????? ?????? is certainly Did you phone home [then]?,
> >> whereas if you want to know whether the action has been performed
at
> >> all, but in the immediate past, then Have you phoned home? is ??
???????
> >> ????? [??????]?  In other words, the perfect illustration of what
we
> >> always tell our students, that aspect is not the same as tense.
> >>
> >> But surely the name of the aspect is ??/???????????, not
??/???????????,
> >> the latter being only the p.p.p. of ??????????
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>>> <xmas at UKR.NET> 08/09/08 7:15 PM >>>
> >> Dear John,    Can you check you examples?     If I were asked I
would
> >> translate them quite to the opposite --      ?? ??????? ??????
[Vy
> >> zvonili domoj?] (nesovershonny, imperfect, ) =  Did you phone
home?
> >> ?? ????????? ?????? [Vy pozvonili domoj?] (sovershonny,
perfective) =
> >> Have you phoned home?    > The distinction between 'Have
you eaten?'
and
> >> 'Did you eat?' is very much alive and well in most
varieties > of
> >> British English. Indeed, I used to refer to this distinction when
> >> teaching the difference between    > imperfective and
perfective
> >> questions in Russian:
> >>
> >>> ?? ??????? ?????? [Vy zvonili domoj?] = Have you phoned home?
> >>> ?? ????????? ?????? [Vy pozvonili domoj?] = Did you phone
home?
> >>
> >>> John Dunn.
> >>
> >> With best regards,
> >> Maria
> >>
> >> --
> >> Mariya M. Dmytriyeva
> >> Fulbright Scholar,
> >> California State University, Northridge
> >> Linguistics Program, 2007-2009
> >>
> >>
>
>>
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> >
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