Russian handwriting in US classrooms in the computer age
Karen Evans-Romaine
evansromaine at WISC.EDU
Thu Sep 9 19:40:54 UTC 2010
Dear Michael (cc Seelangs colleagues),
Why make students download an ASDF keyboard and give up the chance to teach them to type using the Russian standard keyboard already available to them? That is a far more logical and practical choice, both from an ergonomic point of view and for any future work in a Russian office.
Best wishes,
Karen
Karen Evans-Romaine
Associate Professor, Department of Slavic Languages & Literature
Director, Russian Flagship Center
University of Wisconsin - Madison
On 09/09/10, Michael Denner <mdenner at STETSON.EDU> wrote:
> I waste zero time teaching cursive--they need to learn to recognize Russian handwriting (I write on the board) but I think teaching пропись is a waste of valuable resources.
>
> Some students WANT to learn it, and I help them out. But for all written work I accept printed (печатные буквы) Russian. I send 4-6 students a year to Russia and I've never heard a complaint.
>
> One of my first assignments is for them to download an ASDF keyboard (like Russian for Gringos) or use translit.ru and type me a message. We do a lot of free-writing and I require all of it to be sent by email to me for correction.
>
> Finally, I'm slowly moving away even from worrying about typing skills and encouraging students to record dialogues, essays, even their homework assignments. It's something new for me this year, aided in part by the great site vocaroo.com, which allows students to make quick recordings online and post them easily. I'm requiring them to submit the audio files through our class blog (bearinahat.blogspot.com) so they don't fill my inbox. (You can see a few early submissions there already--mostly recordings of poetry.)
>
> This move to recordings is a response to changes in the ways that students communicate: I asked my students recently about their email habits. To a one, they said "The only time I use email is to communicate with my professors." Gosh, I'm so old I remember email being new.
>
> Times they are a'changin...
>
> Oh, and, if you DO still teach handwriting, I cannot recommend highly enough the very cool Primo and Tempo fonts here:
> http://nekin.narod.ru/e25.htm
>
> They're true handwriting fonts, and use a complex macro to connect letters using a variety of liaisons. You'll need to download the documents and fonts, read the instructions carefully. But the results are really impressive--perfect Russian handwriting. I've posted a couple examples here:
> http://tinyurl.com/33gpr22
>
> ~mad
>
> ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
> Dr. Michael A. Denner
> Associate Professor of Russian Studies
> Editor, Tolstoy Studies Journal
> Director, Russian Studies Program
> Director, University Honors Program
>
>
> Contact Information:
> Russian Studies Program
> Stetson University
> Campus Box 8361
> DeLand, FL 32720-3756
> 386.822.7381 (department)
> 386.822.7265 (direct line)
> 386.822.7380 (fax)
>
> google talk michaeladenner
> www.stetson.edu/~mdenner
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at bama.ua.edu](javascript:main.compose() On Behalf Of Melissa Smith
> Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2010 3:37 PM
> To: SEELANGS at bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Russian handwriting in US classrooms in the computer age
>
> Since Youngstown State has a one-year foreign language requirement and
> the bulk of our students stop their study at this level, I only require
> that they be able to READ cursive, and include sections on tests that
> include reading passages in cursive. I subsequently include writing
> assignments like greeting cards for different holidays, and give them
> models written for Russian children. I required that they send me a
> card for March 8th, International Women's Day, which falls about spring
> break, and gave them stamped envelopes and blank cards that they were
> supposed to mail me.
>
> This is not an ideal solution, but I try to compensate by getting them
> accustomed to using internet sources. I once had a student who had
> emigrated to the US at age 13 and wanted to return to study in a
> Russian University. Although she had gone to school and learned cursive
> as a child, she had taken to printing in both languages here. I had to
> convince her that she would be expected to write by hand were she to
> return to study in Moscow, and therefore had to retrain her!
>
> Melissa Smith
>
>
> On 9/8/10 2:26 PM, Beyer, Tom wrote:
> > At Middlebury student learn cursive in first year, much like I learned
> the
> > Palmer method in first grade. They begin using lined paper- two lines
> at
> > first, writing in pen (meaning they have to practice several times
> before
> > the final version). After they have learned the alphabet I give them
> two
> > books used by Russian first graders to practice penmanship.
> > But computers for text input also come into play almost immediately. A
> first
> > night assignment is to print out a page from rambler.ru, just so they
> know
> > their computers have Cyrillic. I also point to input methods, speak of
> > finding and using online dictionaries, how to type in Cyrillic using
> either
> > the Russian or some YAWERTY keyboard or online keyboards. Since some
> have
> > Iphones, Ipads, Itouches, and who knows what else before long, etc I
> simply
> > point them to google and say figure out how to type in Russian one way
> or
> > another on whatever device(s) you have. Many do word lists on the
> > computer,and there are some other assignments in first year: type a
> menu,
> > make a business card, etc. But cursive by hand is still for the
> foreseeable
> > future a necessary skill that I feel we should teach.
> >
> > Good luck and best wishes to all who toil in the garden of Basic
> Russian.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 9/8/10 9:45 AM, "Monnier, Nicole M." <MonnierN at MISSOURI.EDU> wrote:
> >
> > > Richard!
> > >
> > > Great question - one I was contemplating posting to the list as
> well. As I
> > > began the semester this year, I was struck by how many students
> don't use
> > > cursive in English and the added difficulties of this fact for the
> teaching
> > > of Russian cursive.
> > >
> > > As to your conditions, our current textbook (Live from Russia) does
> not have
> > > online exercises, so students inevitably have to handwrite their
> textbook
> > > exercises, as well as their exams and quizzes, so learning cursive is
> > > unavoidable at this juncture. I also tell them that they should be
> taking
> > > notes, and all my notes on the board are in cursive; likewise, when
> they
> > > head off to Russia (I always tell them "when," not "if"!), they're
> going to
> > > find themselves in situations where they'll have to read or write
> cursive.
> > >
> > > HOWEVER, I have been seriously contemplating requiring them to learn
> how to
> > > type in Russian, preferably with the Gosstandart layout (again, on
> the same
> > > premise that they find themselves in Russia some day with no option
> of the
> > > QUERTY translit keyboard), if only because it will give them
> incredible
> > > interactive access to real Russian online (Vkontakte, chat, etc.).
> I'm
> > > thinking about doing this in the second semester of first-year (ours
> is a
> > > 15-week course at 6 hours/week).
> > >
> > > I do not curtail students' use of the computer, though few venture
> onto the
> > > keyboard on their own in any event.
> > >
> > > If our university required all students to have laptops of some
> sort, I
> > > would be even more likely to require students to learn to type in
> Russian.
> > >
> > > Other than that, I can only say that I am as curious as you as to
> other
> > > practices in our field.
> > >
> > > Best,
> > >
> > > Nicole
> > >
> > >
> > > ****************************
> > > Dr. Nicole Monnier
> > > Associate Teaching Professor of Russian
> > > Director of Undergraduate Studies (Russian)
> > > German & Russian Studies
> > > 428A Strickland (formerly GCB)
> > > University of Missouri
> > > Columbia, MO 65211
> > >
> > > phone: 573.882.3370
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 9/8/10 7:48 AM, "Richard Robin" <rrobin at GWU.EDU> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Dear SEELANGers,
> > >>
> > >> I¹d like to get some feedback from colleagues on the issue of
> teaching
> > >> Russian script to beginners in an era of computer-delivered
> materials.
> > >>
> > >> Imagine using a textbook under the following conditions:
> > >>
> > >> 1. Every exercise is online but also available in the printed
> version of
> > >> a student workbook (tear out pages, etc.)
> > >> 2. Your students have computers that can type Cyrillic, and
> using either
> > >> the native Gosstandart layout or the phonetic ³student²
> keyboard, they can
> > >> type Russian.
> > >> 3. While all the exercises are on line, some are (a) machine
> gradable
> > >> (simple choose the ending or fill in the blank with an
> unambiguous word or
> > >> phrase, (b) sentence or paragraph length, submittable
> electronically to
> > >> the
> > >> teacher, but not machine gradable.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Questions:
> > >>
> > >> 1. Do you teach cursive basically for recognition and embrace
> the use of
> > >> all the online exercises?
> > >> 2. Do you limit the use of the students¹ use of the computer
> until they
> > >> have mastered cursive?
> > >> 3. If you answered yes, to Question 2, what are the limits? How
> long must
> > >> they write things by hand? (It helps if you calculate by
> instructional
> > >> hours, where a typical 4-hour a week semester of 15 weeks comes
> to 60
> > >> hours,
> > >> a year ‹ 120 hours). Do they have to write everything by hand or
> is there
> > >> an
> > >> acceptable mix of handwritten work and computer work?
> > >> 4. Any other opinions you have on the subject.
> > >>
> > >> Either public or private answers are appreciated. This is not a
> formal
> > >> scholarly survey (obviously). I just want to get people to express
> some
> > >> opinions on the matter.
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> Richard Robin
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
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>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Melissa T. Smith, Professor
> Department of Foreign Languages and
> Literatures
> Youngstown State University
> Youngstown, OH 44555
> Tel: (330)941-3462
>
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