Fwd: Rejected posting to ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU

Thu Apr 19 17:02:07 UTC 2007

Even up in the frozen North (Minnesota) we said "He stomped on it," though
"stamp out the fire" (verb + particle) would be used.

At 11:33 AM 4/19/2007, you wrote:
>---------------------- Information from the mail header
>-----------------------
>Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>Poster:       Dennis Preston <preston at MSU.EDU>
>Subject:      Fwd: Rejected posting to ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> >Wilson,
> >
> >Certainly wasn't only a Black thang in the 40's. When I was a kid the
> >verb was always 'stomp' and the stuff for postage was a 'stamp.' I
> >couldn't say (for example) "He stamped out a fire" until I went away
> >from the homeland. (Still sounds funny as hell to me.)
> >
> >And certain things I can't say even now, though I know the fancy
> >(Northern?) verb. "He stamped his ass." Impossible. Sounds like he
> >got it ready for mailing or maybe rubber-stamped it.
> >
> >dInIs
> >
> >
> >
> >>---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>-----------------------
> >>Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>Poster:       Wilson Gray <hwgray at GMAIL.COM>
> >>Subject:      Re: change from the bottom up was re: accusative cursing
> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -------
> >>
> >>Not to mention certain pronunciations and turns of phrase that are now
> >>felt as standard. Several years ago, I came across a reprint of a
> >>perhaps century-old book with a title something like, A Lexicon of the
> >>Speech of the Southern-Alabama Negro. Though I've tried for the past
> >>couple of years to track down this publication, I've not been
> >>successful. I've been hoping to see it mentioned by someone here, but,
> >>so far, I''ve been SOL. IAC, the number of now-ordinary words and
> >>phrases that the compiler specifies as peculiar to the speech of black
> >>Southern-Alabamians is quite surprising. Unfortunately, I can recall
> >>only one trivial example: the pronunciation of the verb, "stamp," as
> >>though it was spelled "stomp," a pronunciation that some authors, e.g.
> >>Roger Abrahams, WRT the speech of black Philadelphians, still
> >>considered to be only a black thang as recently as the '60's.
> >>
> >>-Wilson
> >>
> >>On 4/17/07, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>>   ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>>-----------------------
> >>>   Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>>   Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at YAHOO.COM>
> >>>   Subject:      Re: change from the bottom up was re: accusative cursing
> >>>
> >>>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --------
> >>>
> >>>   I agree, though Black English is not the only source.  However, it
> >>>certainly has contributed a great number of (more or less)
> >>>identifiable slang expressions to general American English since
> >>>the Swing Era and especially since the 1960s.
> >>>
> >>>     Slang by (my) definition originates in contexts regarded as
> >>>indecorous by speakers of prestige dialects.
> >>>
> >>>     JL
> >>>
> >>>   Amy West <medievalist at W-STS.COM> wrote:
> >>>     ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>>-----------------------
> >>>   Sender: American Dialect Society
> >>>   Poster: Amy West
> >>>   Subject: change from the bottom up was re: accusative cursing
> >>>
> >>>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --------
> >>>
> >>>   Hmmm...I like CPE; however I wonder if my students will be more
> >>>   confused if I use that while our Longman's Writer's Companion uses
> >>>   SWE.
> >>>
> >>>   I'm much more interested by the "phonetic changes work up" statement.
> >>>   I've run across a similar analysis relating to slang terms entering
> >>>   the language in a chapter in _Slam Dunks & No-Brainers_ where the
> >>>   author argues that many slang terms work their way "up" from Black
> >>>   Vernacular English into the dominant dialect. Being a newbie, I
> >>>   wasn't sure if this was a consensus view in the field or not.
> >>>
> >>>   ---Amy West
> >>>
> >>>   >I use, and prefer, the term Conventional Plublic English, rather than
> >>>   >Standard English, because, of course, there are no language
> >>>standards, just
> >>>   >lots of opinions, and opinions influence conventions, but not
> standards.
> >>>   >Labov's, Wolfram's and Trudgill's research indicates that
> >>>phonetic changes
> >>>   >work up rather than down suggests that conventions, not standards, are
> >>>   >altered from below. Have you looked at your son's pants lately?
> >>>   >
> >>>   >JCS
> >  >>
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> >>   >
> >>>
> >>>
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> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>--
> >>All say, "How hard it is that we have to die"---a strange complaint to
> >>come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
> >>-----
> >>                                                        -Sam'l Clemens
> >>
> >>"Experience" is the ability to recognize a mistake when you make it again.
> >>
> >>------------------------------------------------------------
> >>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
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>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org

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