Fwd: Rejected posting to ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU

[Jonathan Lighter]

In NYC in the '50s one "stamped" one's foot.  Street gangs "stomped" victims.  That was the difference.

  JL

Dennis Preston <preston at MSU.EDU> wrote:
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Sender: American Dialect Society
Poster: Dennis Preston

Subject: Fwd: Rejected posting to ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
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>
>Wilson,
>
>Certainly wasn't only a Black thang in the 40's. When I was a kid the
>verb was always 'stomp' and the stuff for postage was a 'stamp.' I
>couldn't say (for example) "He stamped out a fire" until I went away
>from the homeland. (Still sounds funny as hell to me.)
>
>And certain things I can't say even now, though I know the fancy
>(Northern?) verb. "He stamped his ass." Impossible. Sounds like he
>got it ready for mailing or maybe rubber-stamped it.
>
>dInIs
>
>
>
>>---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>-----------------------
>>Sender: American Dialect Society
>>Poster: Wilson Gray
>>Subject: Re: change from the bottom up was re: accusative cursing
>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>Not to mention certain pronunciations and turns of phrase that are now
>>felt as standard. Several years ago, I came across a reprint of a
>>perhaps century-old book with a title something like, A Lexicon of the
>>Speech of the Southern-Alabama Negro. Though I've tried for the past
>>couple of years to track down this publication, I've not been
>>successful. I've been hoping to see it mentioned by someone here, but,
>>so far, I''ve been SOL. IAC, the number of now-ordinary words and
>>phrases that the compiler specifies as peculiar to the speech of black
>>Southern-Alabamians is quite surprising. Unfortunately, I can recall
>>only one trivial example: the pronunciation of the verb, "stamp," as
>>though it was spelled "stomp," a pronunciation that some authors, e.g.
>>Roger Abrahams, WRT the speech of black Philadelphians, still
>>considered to be only a black thang as recently as the '60's.
>>
>>-Wilson
>>
>>On 4/17/07, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>>-----------------------
>>> Sender: American Dialect Society
>>> Poster: Jonathan Lighter
>>> Subject: Re: change from the bottom up was re: accusative cursing
>>>
>>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> I agree, though Black English is not the only source. However, it
>>>certainly has contributed a great number of (more or less)
>>>identifiable slang expressions to general American English since
>>>the Swing Era and especially since the 1960s.
>>>
>>> Slang by (my) definition originates in contexts regarded as
>>>indecorous by speakers of prestige dialects.
>>>
>>> JL
>>>
>>> Amy West wrote:
>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>>-----------------------
>>> Sender: American Dialect Society
>>> Poster: Amy West
>>> Subject: change from the bottom up was re: accusative cursing
>>>
>>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Hmmm...I like CPE; however I wonder if my students will be more
>>> confused if I use that while our Longman's Writer's Companion uses
>>> SWE.
>>>
>>> I'm much more interested by the "phonetic changes work up" statement.
>>> I've run across a similar analysis relating to slang terms entering
>>> the language in a chapter in _Slam Dunks & No-Brainers_ where the
>>> author argues that many slang terms work their way "up" from Black
>>> Vernacular English into the dominant dialect. Being a newbie, I
>>> wasn't sure if this was a consensus view in the field or not.
>>>
>>> ---Amy West
>>>
>>> >I use, and prefer, the term Conventional Plublic English, rather than
>>> >Standard English, because, of course, there are no language
>>>standards, just
>>> >lots of opinions, and opinions influence conventions, but not standards.
>>> >Labov's, Wolfram's and Trudgill's research indicates that
>>>phonetic changes
>>> >work up rather than down suggests that conventions, not standards, are
>>> >altered from below. Have you looked at your son's pants lately?
>>> >
>>> >JCS
> >>
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>> >
>>>
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>>
>>
>>--
>>All say, "How hard it is that we have to die"---a strange complaint to
>>come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
>>-----
>> -Sam'l Clemens
>>
>>"Experience" is the ability to recognize a mistake when you make it again.
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------
>>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org

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