[hw-] v. [w]

[Paul Johnston]

Indeed, Dennis--he's certainly not trying to imitate UK English in
any way here.  It's southern US.

Paul
On Aug 1, 2007, at 6:16 PM, Dennis R. Preston wrote:

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> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       "Dennis R. Preston" <preston at MSU.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: [hw-] v. [w]
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> ---------
>
> Why would /ai/ monphthongization and r-loss indicate an attempt at
> British Englsh. Why not southern US? Am I missing something (in which
> case /ae/ in "dance" and "France" would be right on).
>
> dInIs
>
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>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> Poster:       Beverly Flanigan <flanigan at OHIO.EDU>
>> Subject:      Re: [hw-] v. [w]
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>> ----------
>>
>> At 05:19 PM 8/1/2007, you wrote:
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>>> Poster:       Benjamin Zimmer <bgzimmer at BABEL.LING.UPENN.EDU>
>>> Subject:      Re: [hw-] v. [w]
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> -----------
>>>
>>> On 8/1/07, Beverly Flanigan <flanigan at ohio.edu> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> [David A. Daniel wrote:]
>>>>>
>>>>> [Scott LaFaive wrote:]
>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't have an [h] anywhere near my [w]'s (Wisconsin
>>>>>> dialect), so I
>>>  don't
>>>>>> even know what this sounds like. Any good sound files for this?
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob Dylan, Lay Lady Lay. He could blow out a candle with his
>>> "...stay with
>>>>> your man a hhhhhhhwile"
>>>>
>>>> As Peter Trudgill pointed out in a 1983 paper ("Acts of Conflicting
>>>> Identity"), Dylan tried to use a Midland/Appalachian accent in
>>>> his early
>>>> songs, often with hypercorrection.  Hence "a while" was [e
>>> hwail] (or maybe
>>>> even [e hwal]?) and "the times they are [e tSendZiN]."  As a
>>>> Minnesotan,
>>>> Dylan would have never used [hw] in his own persona, and I
>>>> wonder if he
>>>> didn't drop it in his later songs too?
>>>
>>> "Lay Lady Lay" wasn't that early of a song in the Dylan oeuvre --
>>> it's from
>>> 1969, off the "Nashville Skyline" album (his 9th album in 8
>>> years). I don't
>>> recall what Trudgill has to say on the matter, but my sense is
>>> that Dylan
>>> didn't lose his singing accent in the way that the Beatles and
>>> the Stones
>>> eventually gave up on Americanized phonology as Trudgill describes.
>>>
>>>
>>> --Ben Zimmer
>>>
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>>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
>> Actually, Trudgill only cites one song from Dylan, and it's
>> neither of the
>> two I cited above; I use those two in class, along with this one from
>> Trudgill:
>>
>> You may be an [aembaes at d@]
>> To England or [@] France
>> You may [la:k] to gamble
>> You [ma:t] [la:k] to dance . . . (from _Slow Train Coming_, 1979)
>>
>> He notes that Dylan, "from Minnesota, in the American Mid-West,"
>> has /ai/ =
>> [ai] and non-prevocalic /r/ in his speech but uses [a:] and r-loss
>> in his
>> singing style (1983, p. 146).  He fails to note, though, that
>> Dylan used
>> [ae] in both 'France' and 'dance'--typical of his half-assed
>> attempt at
>> British English.  But I must admit I really haven't followed him
>> since
>> about that time.
>>
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>
>
> --
> Dennis R. Preston
> University Distinguished Professor
> Department of English
> 15C Morrill Hall
> Michigan State University
> East Lansing, MI 48824
> 517-353-4736
> preston at msu.edu
>
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