"nayger" [WAS: Re: Rastus (was: "Jazz Means Happy and Loose Like" (1917))]
Wilson Gray
hwgray at GMAIL.COM
Mon Dec 10 02:56:50 UTC 2007
I've heard that lie before. (Not that I intend to claim that you're in
any sense a liar. It's just that BE is way less trivially polite than
sE. The phrase means only that I'm familiar with that claim and, like
you, am neutral as to its merit.) In a kind of mirror-image reaction,
a friend of mine from Minneapolis (yes, fellow Southrons, I know that,
WRT public participation, the largest lynching in history occurred in
Minnesota), unfamiliar with "nigra" [nIgr@] until after he had seen it
in print, pronounced it [naigr@].
-Wilson
On Dec 9, 2007 1:02 PM, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster: Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at YAHOO.COM>
> Subject: Re: "nayger" [WAS: Re: Rastus (was: "Jazz Means Happy and Loose
> Like" (1917))]
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Niger" was apparently pronounced / i / until, perhaps, it became an archaic form learned from print.
>
> JL
>
> "Dennis R. Preston" <preston at MSU.EDU> wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender: American Dialect Society
> Poster: "Dennis R. Preston"
>
> Subject: Re: "nayger" [WAS: Re: Rastus (was: "Jazz Means Happy and Loose
> Like" (1917))]
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> JL,
>
> I don't understand the concept of levelling here. If "Niger" was
> pronounced /ay/ (LIGHT) (forget the quality of the 'g') and "Neger"
> was pronounced /ey/ (FACE) or /e/ (BET), what is the levelling
> process that yields /I/ (HIT)?
>
> dInIs
>
> >---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >-----------------------
> >Sender: American Dialect Society
> >Poster: Jonathan Lighter
> >Subject: "nayger" [WAS: Re: Rastus (was: "Jazz Means Happy and
> >Loose Like"
> > (1917))]
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >"Nayger" is a dial. remnant of 16th C. "Neger."
> >
> > I once did a good deal of research on these forms. Some of the
> >results are in HDAS. Some further upshots:
> >
> > 1. "Nigger" is not a variant pronunciation (or
> >"mispronunciation") of "Negro."
> >
> > 2. a. "Niger" (one "g") was until the early to mid 18th C. a
> >mostly neutral term.
> > b. "Nigger" results from a leveling of both "Neger" and "Niger."
> >
> > 3. Runaway slave notices, slave auction ads, etc., which would not
> >seem to require euphemisms, uniformly employ "Negro," as though
> >"nigger" were inappropriate for polite use..
> >
> > 4. The earliest printed exx. of "nigger" as a term of
> >white-against-black abuse are from the early 19th C.
> >
> > JL
> >
>
> >Wilson Gray wrote:
> > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >-----------------------
> >Sender: American Dialect Society
> >Poster: Wilson Gray
> >Subject: Re: Rastus (was: "Jazz Means Happy and Loose Like" (1917))
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Makes sense to me, Mark, although I'd call it more "unpopular than
> >"pejorative," mainly because it's been rare in my experience - I've
> >seen it in print; I *may* have heard it very rarely when I was a
> >child, but it wouldn't have had any special meaning. Besides, to the
> >extent that I remember it at all, it was used about as often for
> >cartoon, po'-white, hillbilly types as for blacks in literature of the
> >day. I've known "nigger," well, "nigguh," since I was four or five
> >years old, when it packed less than the emotional weight of, perhaps,
> >"dumbbell." Being called "nigger" by another nigger wouldn't send
> >anybody home crying, but being called "dumbbell" by someone else who
> >wasn't one might. It was only when it was used against me by white
> >people that it became truly hurtful. E.g. I was waiting for the bus in
> >Central Square Cambridge to go visit my girlfriend in Boston, so you
> >can imagine where my mind was. I vaguely noticed a white man walking
> >toward me. As he passed, he sneered at me, "You Goddamned nigger!" and
> >continued on his way as though nothing had happened. I was caught
> >completely off guard and totally discombobulated, not knowing whether
> >to shit or go blind. Had I been a child, I might well have broken into
> >tears.
> >
> >Then, when I got over to my girlfriend's house, she was in a foul mood
> >and, with the down-so-low-that-I- had-to-look-up-at-my-feet mood that
> >I was in, it killed the relationship.
> >
> >But, speaking from the point of view of dialect, I'd read somewhere or
> >other that, back in the day, the Irish referred to blacks using a
> >pronunciation that sounded to the authors like "naygurs." The white
> >man of whom I speak said what sounded to me like "naygah" [ne:ga].
> >(Unforunately, this wasn't the first time that I had heard this
> >pronunciation. I've merely supplied a sample anecdote.) Supposedly,
> >Boston is the most Irish of American cities. So, WAG, perhaps this
> >pronunciation is a cross between the old-time Irish pronunciation and
> >the ah-less New England pronunciation.
> >
> >-Wilson
> >
> >On Dec 5, 2007 1:42 PM, Mark Mandel wrote:
> >> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>-----------------------
> >> Sender: American Dialect Society
> >> Poster: Mark Mandel
> >> Subject: Rastus (was: "Jazz Means Happy and Loose Like" (1917))
> > >
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> (thread in ADS-L; cc to ANS-L)
> >>
> >> On Dec 3, 2007 2:38 PM, Arnold M. Zwicky wrote:
> >>
> >> > check out the wikipedia on Rastus, which suggests that the name Rastus
> >> > was from Erastus and was given by slave-owners to their slaves -- and
> >> > quickly became generalized as a pejorative term used by whites for
> >> > blacks. (the Cream of Wheat guy is named Rastus, by the way, though i
> >> > suspect that the company no longer uses the name.)
> >>
> >> On Dec 4, 2007 12:39 AM, Wilson Gray replied:
> >>
> >> > I pretty much agree with "Rastus" as being derived from "Erastus." But
> >> > "Erastus" is a Latinization of Greek "Erastos." This is derived from
> >> > _era-_, love (in the sexual sense). Would a slave, especially a male
> >> > one, have been given such a name? It seems unlikely, from the
> >> > contemporary impression of what that period was like. But, who really
> >> > knows, nowadays?
> >>
> >>
> >> That argument is based on the assumption that the namer (owner, blech!) kne=
> >> w
> >> the Greek etymology. ISTM just as likely that many knew it only as a Latin
> >> name, and some may have known that it came from Greek, but very few would
> >> have known the origin within Greek.
> >>
> >> And for that matter (I continue with WAGgery), all it would have taken was
> >> one or a few masters applying the name, and others picking it up with littl=
> >> e
> >> or no knowledge of its antecedents. Does the historical documentation allow
> >> any inference on diachronic spread?
> >>
> >> The article has been modified since Arnold's post, including deletion of th=
> >> e
> >> sentence "During the period of [[American slavery]], it was common practice
> >> for owners to give their slaves historical, and particularly Biblical,
> >> names."
> >>
> >> The article now reads in part (latest
> >> revision: 00:01, 5 December 2007; lists of examples snipped; emphasis
> >> added):
> >>
> >> Rastus is a pejorative term traditionally associated with African Americans
> >> > in the United States. It is considered highly offensive
> >> >
> >> > The name is sometimes given as 'Rastus, and it is likely a shortening of
> >> > Erastus, a disciple of St. Paul mentioned in Acts 19:22, Romans 16:23, an=
> >> d 2
> >> > Timothy 4:20. "Rastus" has been used as a generic, often derogatory, name
> >> > for Black men at least since 1880, when Joel Chandler Harris included a
> >> > Black deacon named "Brer Rastus" in the first Uncle Remus book. **Contrar=
> >> y
> >> > to popular belief, however, "Rastus" has never been particularly popular =
> >> as
> >> > a Black name.** For example, the 1870 census reported only 42 individuals
> >> > named "Rastus" in the United States, of whom only four were Black or
> >> > mulatto. Rastus=97as any happy black man, not as a particular person=97be=
> >> came a
> >> > familiar character in minstrel shows (...), in books (...), in popular so=
> >> ngs
> >> > (...), on radio, and in films, most notably the Rastus series of short fi=
> >> lms
> >> > (...).
> >> > (usage for Cream of Wheat )
> >> >
> >>
> >> m a m
> >>
> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >All say, "How hard it is that we have to die"---a strange complaint to
> >come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
> >-----
> >-Sam'l Clemens
> >
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> >
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>
> --
> Dennis R. Preston
> University Distinguished Professor
> Department of English
> 15C Morrill Hall
> Michigan State University
> East Lansing, MI 48824
> 517-353-4736
> preston at msu.edu
>
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--
All say, "How hard it is that we have to die"---a strange complaint to
come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
-----
-Sam'l Clemens
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