"until" vs "before" or "to"

[Jonathan Lighter]

I used to say "of" but at some point switched to "to" and "till."  The change was made quite unconsciously, like more and more of what I do these days.

  JL

Susan Rosine <basenjiluvr at MSN.COM> wrote:
  ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
Sender: American Dialect Society
Poster: Susan Rosine
Subject: Re: "until" vs "before" or "to"
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My mother is from Alabama, my father from Indiana. I was born in Colorado
but grew up in Washington state. I say "10 til 6" and "quarter til 6". The
"til" seems to be to be Southern, while "of" seems very Northern or East
Coast. Just my two cents worth.


Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 22:46:11 -0400
From: sagehen
Subject: Re: "until" vs "before" or "to"

>Did the announcer say "until" or "till"? "Till" is more common, and the
>standard term in the Midland (and South, I believe). It goes way back,
>noted in early travel journals as of Scotch-Irish origin. Dictionaries
>cite it as a separate lexical item, if I'm not mistaken, more related to
>"to" than to "until." (I don't have my sources here at home, but I've
>cited this in my Encyclopedia of Appalachia entry of 2006, and Michael
>Montgomery has discussed it long before that.) As a common daily usage, it
>goes deep: I always tell my students that I, a Northerner born and bred,
>will always say "quarter to," but my Indiana/Ohio son will forever say
>"quarter till." The third option is usually "quarter of"; I've never heard
>"quarter before" (or 15 minutes before). This seems to me simply
>dialectal, not semantic. I forget where you live, Sage Hen?
>
>Beverly Flanigan
>Ohio University
>
>At 08:02 PM 7/16/2007, you wrote:
>>---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>-----------------------
>>Sender: American Dialect Society
>>Poster: sagehen
>>Subject: "until" vs "before" or "to"
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>>-
>>
>>(a) It is now 25 minutes until 6.
>>(b) It is now 25 minutes before 6.
>>(c) It is now 25 minutes to 6.
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~
>>What's the difference?
>>
>> (a) feels wrong to me, unless sthg important is going to happen at 6.
>>
>> (b) & (c) as simple announcements of the time seem right.
>>
>>Is this just me, or do others have the same sense? I would probably never
>>have thought of this if one of our local radio announcers didn't use the
>>"until" form regularly, catching my attention. Most of them say
>>"before."
>>AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This particular announcer definitely says "until." The station is in
Canton NY, but its personnel come from all over the country.
I myself would be more likely to say "25 of 6" or "quarter of" than "
till" or "to" or "before." I grew up in Lincoln NE.
AM

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