Chinglish

[Tom Zurinskas]

Well, why don't you do try the drill and  tell us how to do it.  Maybe even do an eval of your own on the visual.  Are you sure audacity can capture a m-w.com sound file?  Did you try it.  How is it done.

Tom Zurinskas, USA - CT20, TN3, NJ33, FL5+
See truespel.com - and the 4 truespel books plus "Occasional Poems" at authorhouse.com.

> Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 00:37:55 +0800
> From: strangeguitars at GMAIL.COM
> Subject: Re: Chinglish
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender: American Dialect Society
> Poster: LanDi Liu
> Subject: Re: Chinglish
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 10:47 PM, Tom Zurinskas  wrote:
>> We can reduce variability by using a standard pronunciation source like m-w.com, a very good one.
>>
>> I've got praat. Somebody tell us how to copy the m-w.com voicing and compare waveforms and formant numbers.
>
> Well, you can download Audacity and record the m-w sounds, then put
> them into Praat. Download Audacity here:
> http://audacity.sourceforge.net/
>
> It's easier to use than Praat. Once you have the m-w pronunciations
> in Praat, you can see the numbers for the formants for each vowel, and
> compare the vowels in different words.
>
> I'm glad you're considering looking at measurements. If I stand
> outside, it's obvious to my eyes that the Sun and the Moon are equal
> distances from the Earth, but we all know that's not so. I have very
> good, and well-trained ears, especially for hearing vowels, but I
> wouldn't dream of making statements about vowels to the linguistics
> community without backing up those statements with some sort of
> measurements. Or if I did, I wouldn't do so very seriously.
>
> Good luck with the formants.
>
> Randy
>
> But it's obvious to my ear that the vowel sounds for "i" are
> different in the following,
>>
>> ching vs chin
>> wing/wink vs win
>> king/kink vs kin
>> think/think vs thin
>>
>> It's more than an allophone thing. It's a full phoneme shift.
>>
>> Here's a thought. Suppose you take the word "sheep" ~shee. That's a true long e, right, as pronounced in m-w.com. And you replace "p" with "ng" to make nonsense word ~sheeng (with a true long e). Then say to other folks: "Spell this word - ~sheeng." I predict they would spell it "shing" and say it rhymes with all the other "ing" words, like wing, sing.
>>
>> Tom Zurinskas, USA - CT20, TN3, NJ33, FL5+
>> See truespel.com - and the 4 truespel books plus "Occasional Poems" at authorhouse.com.
>>
>>> Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:59:18 -0500
>>> From: gordonmj at MISSOURI.EDU
>>> Subject: Re: Chinglish
>>> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>>>
>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
>>> Sender: American Dialect Society
>>> Poster: Matthew Gordon
>>> Subject: Re: Chinglish
>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> You can't ever take variability out of the equation. Each human vocal tract
>>> is unique. Your [i] will have different acoustic characteristics from mine
>>> due simply to the fact that they're played on different instruments. In
>>> fact, there is intraspeaker variation too; each time you pronounce an [i] it
>>> will differ acoustically from the last time you pronounced one.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8/27/08 7:57 PM, "Tom Zurinskas" wrote:
>>>
>>>> I would like to trust the numbers to identify vowels. I've played with Praat
>>>> (I assume the "aa" is pronuounced "ah" like "Saab" (foespeld ~aa in truespel).
>>>> I'm not practiced at it but I find it hard to determine vowel identity by
>>>> numbers or wave forms. If this is possible with practice, it would be a good
>>>> thing, taking human bias and variability out of the equation.
>>>>
>>>> Tom Zurinskas, USA - CT20, TN3, NJ33, FL5+
>>>> See truespel.com - and the 4 truespel books plus "Occasional Poems" at
>>>> authorhouse.com.
>>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Randy Alexander
> Jilin City, China
> My Manchu studies blog:
> http://www.bjshengr.com/manchu
>
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