"hot dog" T.A. Dorgan story in St. Louis Post-Dispatch (UNCLASSIFIED)

[Wilson Gray]

> In 1901, the name "hot dog" began to overtake "frankfurter,"
> "red hot," "dachshund," "frank" and "wiener."

Not quite, among the black Saint Louisans of my youth, for whom
"frankfurters" and "wienies" were distinct and a frank(furter)
sangwich was distinct from a hot dog, though a frank(furter) sangwich
was no more than a hot dog made with a frankfurter instead of a
wienie.

-Wilson

On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 11:14 AM, Mullins, Bill AMRDEC
<Bill.Mullins at us.army.mil> wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       "Mullins, Bill AMRDEC" <Bill.Mullins at US.ARMY.MIL>
> Subject:      Re: "hot dog" T.A. Dorgan story in St. Louis Post-Dispatch
>              (UNCLASSIFIED)
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED
> Caveats: NONE
>
> The Post Dispatch made the same mistake in 2006 ("HOT CORNER" St. Louis
> Post-Dispatch (MO) - July 30, 2006
> Author: DERRICK GOOLD, p. D7); likewise The Bangor ME Daily News ("This
> month, we celebrate the hot dog" Bangor Daily News (ME) - July 13, 2006
> TOM WEBER: p. B1); Portland Oregonian ("NEWS Q&A - I have always
> wondered how hot dogs got such an odd name" Oregonian, The (Portland,
> OR) - July 4, 2006 p. A01); Palm Springs Desert Sun ("The All-American
> dog - well, sort of" Desert Sun, The (Palm Springs, CA) - April 13, 2006
> Author: The Desert Sun, Staff p. P11); San Diego Union Tribune ("Babe
> not alone in his love of hot dogs" San Diego Union-Tribune, The (CA) -
> November 26, 2005 Author: Don Freeman p. E-9), and a bunch of other
> newspapers in Newsbank.
>
> Gerry, and others -- do you want an electronic copy of the 2004 article
> you mention below?
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: American Dialect Society
>> [mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of Cohen, Gerald Leonard
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 9:13 PM
>> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>> Subject: "hot dog" T.A. Dorgan story in St. Louis Post-Dispatch
>>
>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> -----------------------
>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> Poster:       "Cohen, Gerald Leonard" <gcohen at MST.EDU>
>> Subject:      "hot dog" T.A. Dorgan story in St. Louis Post-Dispatch
>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>> -----------------
>>
>> The T.A. Dorgan story on "hot dog" continues unabated.  The
>> usually excellent St. Louis Post-Dispatch presents this story
>> today as possibly being accurate, which is equivalent to
>> giving credence to the views of the flat-earth society.
>> There's no possibility that the T.A. Dorgan story is
>> accurate. None. zero.
>>
>>   My thanks to Barry Popik for e-mailing me the two links
>> below--the first is a St Louis Post-Dispatch story on the
>> "hot dog" book that Barry Popik, the late David Shulman, and
>> I published in 2004.  The second one is today's story in the
>> St. Louis Post-Dispatch.  If its author (Anthony Hagan) is
>> ever curious about what really happened, he need only ask.
>>
>>       Meanwhile, on a general note, the T.A. Dorgan Polo
>> Grounds hot-dog story shows the persistence of a folk
>> etymology in the face of incontrovertible evidence to the
>> contrary.  It's such a good story, why give it up merely
>> because it's been disproven?
>>
>>       As for the two links, they're given below my signoff.
>>
>> Gerald Cohen
>> P.S. The incorrect T. A. Dorgan story is about a baseball
>> game at the POLO GROUNDS.  It wasn't about a polo match, as
>> Hagan writes. But, hey, as long as facts don't matter, why
>> sweat these details?
>>
>> [Two "hot dog" links]:
>> ...
>> Word sleuths dig up true origin of the term "hot dog"
>> <http://docs.newsbank.com/g/GooglePM/SL/lib00170,1073CC625FF3B
>> 5E2.html>
>>
>> $2.95 - St. Louis Post-Dispatch - NewsBank - Dec 26, 2004 ...
>> was a staple of humor in the 19th century and in the 20th,"
>> says Gerald Cohen, ... As a part of speech, hot dog has had
>> legs. Cohen and colleagues also ...
>> ...
>> ...
>> http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/lifestyle/stories.nsf/cooking
>> /story/BB2F537BBBB32657862574780066563C?OpenDocument
>> Hot dogs has evolved into an all-American favorite By Anthony
>> Hagan ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
>> 07/02/2008
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> In 1901, the name "hot dog" began to overtake "frankfurter,"
>> "red hot," "dachshund," "frank" and "wiener." The story goes
>> that Tad Dorgan, a New York Journal sports cartoonist, was
>> attending a polo match on a blustery April day when he
>> noticed vendors selling sausages kept hot in portable water
>> tanks. The vendors were shouting: "They're red hot! Get your
>> dachshund sausages while they're red hot!"
>>
>> Dorgan quickly drew a sketch of the scene, and not knowing
>> how to spell dachshund, he called them "hot dogs."
>>
>> However, historians cannot locate the cartoon that supposedly
>> coined the phrase. Others say the term was originated when
>> Yale's student newspaper wrote about "dog wagons" selling hot
>> dogs in fall 1894.
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
> Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED
> Caveats: NONE
>
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> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
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