Odd rhyme claim

[Paul Johnston]

I'd imagine it would be with the low rounded back vowel, though Mel
Ott's name would be pronounced with the same vowel too.  The symbol
is a turned script a, which my students always confuse with a capital
D.  Come to think of it, at least in some New England dialects, ought
would be pronounced with the same vowel as well.  The vowel in
'"pahking cahs" is much, much fronter, and unrounded,  it's IPA [a:].

Yours,
Paul Johnston
On Dec 15, 2009, at 11:56 PM, Joel S. Berson wrote:

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> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET>
> Subject:      Re: Odd rhyme claim
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>
> At 12/15/2009 11:00 PM, Jerome Foster wrote:
>> For a current example listen to Click and Clack, the Magliozzi
>> brothers on
>> NPR.
>
> Do they say "ought" ("awt") -- which I can't relate to "patriot",
> even in New England, or "ott", as in the baseball player Mel -- which
> I can imagine in New England for both "patriot" and "thought"
> ("thott" -- the vowel a little like "cah" for "carr"?)  I'll have to
> listen next Saturday.
>
> Joel
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Tom Zurinskas" <truespel at HOTMAIL.COM>
>> To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 7:22 PM
>> Subject: Re: Odd rhyme claim
>>
>>
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>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>> Poster:       Tom Zurinskas <truespel at HOTMAIL.COM>
>>> Subject:      Re: Odd rhyme claim
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>>> -----------
>>>
>>> "Patriot" rhyming with thought" wouldn't work for me from Conn.
>>> but for my
>>> =
>>> neighbor from Mass it would.  For her "ot" would be spoken
>>> "ought".  The
>>> le=
>>> tter "o" often took the "awe" sound.  She would call me ~Taumee
>>> (~au as in
>>> =
>>> "awe") and her son as ~Baubee (Bobby).  This is over 40 years ago.
>>>
>>> Tom Zurinskas=2C USA - CT20=2C TN3=2C NJ33=2C FL7+=20
>>> see truespel.com phonetic spelling
>>>
>>>
>>> =20
>>> =20
>>>> Date: Tue=2C 15 Dec 2009 16:27:28 -0500
>>>> From: wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM
>>>> Subject: Odd rhyme claim
>>>> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>>>> =20
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>>>> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>> Poster: Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
>>>> Subject: Odd rhyme claim
>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> ------=
>>> ------
>>>> =20
>>>> The poet John Hollander asserts that New England is "the only
>>>> region of
>>>> t=
>>> he
>>>> nation" (or was in Emerson's time) "in whose dialect _patriot_
>>>> rhymes
>>>> wit=
>>> h
>>>> _thought_."
>>>> =20
>>>> Really? I'd have guessed that _patriot_ "rhymes" with _thought_
>>>> nowhere
>>>> o=
>>> n
>>>> Panet Earth. Or is Hollander being facetious at Emerson's
>>>> expense? Yeah=
>>> =2C
>>>> that must be it. Sorry.
>>>> =20
>>>> On the other hand....I'm curious.
>>>> =20
>>>> JL
>>>> =20
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